CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 nflagey wrote:
Leak from the French:

Stompa is one of the funniest model in the codex, with an infinite re-roll apparently on the gatling ... but the gun might stop working for the whole game too

920pts though

worth it

40PV

Is 40 wounds for 920 points worth it though? What are the stats on the gun? And what do you mean by infinite reroll?

sounds like the rule that was already leaked (I think) ... which says the 6s are rerolled, and the rerolls can be rerolled, etc ...

don't quote me though, I missed the details of the rule but that seems to be the intent

Oh sweet jesus yes!

From French wargame studio:

Shockjump dragsta: 110

Kustom boosta blasta: 120 (yes it mispelled the name before.)

Squigbuggy: 140


The stompa is the coolest unit of the dex. The most fun unit from it's rules with the psycho boosta blasta. But it's still worth it. It's 920 points but with dakkadakkadakka and so much health it worth it. And there is a stratagem to make the 6+ explodes on 5+ instead! And better, it makes the auto hit on malus BS hit on 5+ too!

Psychocouac wrote:
Oh sweet jesus yes!

From French wargame studio:

Shockjump dragsta: 110

Kustom boosta blasta: 120 (yes it mispelled the name before.)

Squigbuggy: 140


The stompa is the coolest unit of the dex. The most fun unit from it's rules with the psycho boosta blasta. But it's still worth it. It's 920 points but with dakkadakkadakka and so much health it worth it. And there is a stratagem to make the 6+ explodes on 5+ instead! And better, it makes the auto hit on malus BS hit on 5+ too!

Merci Psychocouac

Psychocouac wrote:
Oh sweet jesus yes!

From French wargame studio:

Shockjump dragsta: 110

Kustom boosta blasta: 120 (yes it mispelled the name before.)

Squigbuggy: 140


The stompa is the coolest unit of the dex. The most fun unit from it's rules with the psycho boosta blasta. But it's still worth it. It's 920 points but with dakkadakkadakka and so much health it worth it. And there is a stratagem to make the 6+ explodes on 5+ instead! And better, it makes the auto hit on malus BS hit on 5+ too!

Well, I'm very happy to be proven wrong. The boosta-blasta is probably usable at 120.

Keep all the crap on the squigbuggy! Let the others be decent!

Index only units will exist. If painboy on bike is index only that fine as he still has the <clan> Keyword.

As do the other index bike units.

120 for the KBB still seems like 30-40 points too many but I guess we'll see after some testing.. Better than the absurd 140 at least

Edit: Then you gotta wonder why the KBB isn't 6PL, oh well. It's all part of lifes little mysteries I guess

PDB would be especially fun if you can reroll the 2d6...at least once.

I asked about the Shock Attack gun:

"It's not that expensive, something like 65~75 points. But it's really random with the 2D6." (2D6 shots i suppose.)

Codex review on saturday.

Psychocouac wrote:
I asked about the Shock Attack gun:

"It's not that expensive, something like 65~75 points. But it's really random with the 2D6." (2D6 shots i suppose.)

A SAG has 2d6 Strength

PiñaColada wrote:

Psychocouac wrote:
I asked about the Shock Attack gun:

"It's not that expensive, something like 65~75 points. But it's really random with the 2D6." (2D6 shots i suppose.)

A SAG has 2d6 Strength

Aw, maybe it's still 1D6 shot then. =/



He also said that the scrapjet is really good.

 JimOnMars wrote:
PDB would be especially fun if you can reroll the 2d6...at least once.

Also bear in mind that the supa-gatla is now 3D6 shots.

As for an infinite shots.........in the index, you get to shoot again if you roll a certain value. Maybe that value gets fixed, and as long as you roll above it, you shoot again?

Like, shoot 3D6, on a 2+ you shoot again. Then, on a 3+ you shoot again. Etc until it's a 6+ to shoot again, but you can always shoot again as long as you roll a 6. But if you don't make the roll you're out of ammo for the rest of the game.

 Kap'n Krump wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
PDB would be especially fun if you can reroll the 2d6...at least once.

Also bear in mind that the supa-gatla is now 3D6 shots.

As for an infinite shots.........in the index, you get to shoot again if you roll a certain value. Maybe that value gets fixed, and as long as you roll above it, you shoot again?

that's how I understood it ... check Psychocouac message though

"No new models for the kopter but they are still there."

Psychocouac wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:

Psychocouac wrote:
I asked about the Shock Attack gun:

"It's not that expensive, something like 65~75 points. But it's really random with the 2D6." (2D6 shots i suppose.)

A SAG has 2d6 Strength

Aw, maybe it's still 1D6 shot then. =/



He also said that the scrapjet is really good.

Man, am I happy to hear that! My two favorite buggies, the dragsta and the skrapjet, both looking viable. Itz a good 'un ladz

Psychocouac wrote:
I asked about the Shock Attack gun:

"It's not that expensive, something like 65~75 points. But it's really random with the 2D6." (2D6 shots i suppose.)

Codex review on saturday.

SAGs are already like 65 points. The problem is that 1D6 @ orky BS is hot garbage. 2D6 shots would be an improvement.

And I KNOW there's someone out there in the world with the ork codex in their hand. One day soon, the other hand is going to have a camera in it.

 nflagey wrote:
Leak from the French:

Stompa is one of the funniest model in the codex, with an infinite re-roll apparently on the gatling ... but the gun might stop working for the whole game too

920pts though

worth it

40PV

920pts doesn't sound fun, because even with the rules/weapons we've seen it'll still never get used :/

People have correctly stated that it is objectively worse than a knight that costs half that.

 Kap'n Krump wrote:

And I KNOW there's someone out there in the world with the ork codex in their hand. One day soon, the other hand is going to have a camera in it.

Be sure i'll be here to "translate" saturday when the video comes up. My english is average but i'm so hype you'll have a full report as soon as it goes live. (or even before if someone else has seen some leaks. I-JUST-WANT-TO-KNOW! )

Only GW could take a horrible mode like the Stompa, give it buffs and make it even more expensive.

GW, if something is really, really bad, you make it cheaper or give it buffs. If you give it buffs and then make it more expensive is like you didn't did anything, unless the buffs are so big the increase in price is deserved.
I doubt it. 920 points. Half an army. I can't see a Stompa being worth that.

Just a general FYI, on the saturday that codex preorders go up we've always had the youtube channels WintersSEO and Strikingscorpion82 do youtube reviews. However, they might not show enough actual stats for them to be useful but all the stratagems are revealed and unit abilities are usually talked about

crzylgs wrote:

 nflagey wrote:
Leak from the French:

Stompa is one of the funniest model in the codex, with an infinite re-roll apparently on the gatling ... but the gun might stop working for the whole game too

920pts though

worth it

40PV

920pts doesn't sound fun, because even with the rules/weapons we've seen it'll still never get used :/

People have correctly stated that it is objectively worse than a knight that costs half that.

I don't know. With the stratagem that boost dakkadakkadakka it might be quite scary? Exploding 5 and 6 and no malus modifier? And Bad moons? If someone better than me in math could make the stats. ^^"

Squigbuggy appears to have been both designed and priced by the people in this thread constantly saying that averages don't matter with random combinations of dice rolls.

It appears the design team was perhaps more impressed with the numbers leading the D6 count than their actual casualty output. Because that points cost couldnt have come from play testing.

 TedNugent wrote:
Squigbuggy appears to have been both designed and priced by the people in this thread constantly saying that averages don't matter with random combinations of dice rolls.

It appears the design team was perhaps more impressed with the numbers leading the D6 count than their actual casualty output. Because that points cost couldnt have come from play testing.

Perhaps they decided on the price by rolling a d200?

Psychocouac wrote:

crzylgs wrote:

 nflagey wrote:
Leak from the French:

Stompa is one of the funniest model in the codex, with an infinite re-roll apparently on the gatling ... but the gun might stop working for the whole game too

920pts though

worth it

40PV

920pts doesn't sound fun, because even with the rules/weapons we've seen it'll still never get used :/

People have correctly stated that it is objectively worse than a knight that costs half that.

I don't know. With the stratagem that boost dakkadakkadakka it might be quite scary? Exploding 5 and 6 and no malus modifier? And Bad moons? If someone better than me in math could make the stats. ^^"

And then the gun stops working because that's how GW 'balance' Orks. Fun. Right?

Seriously though, I can't see how it can have enough Dakka to justify 920 points. When currently its not worth even half of that.

Stompa is still over 900pts?
ugh...better have buffed the crap out of it. 40hp sounds like a lot but thats still not that tough to take down when its pretty much the only big thing to fire all the high damage guns at.

Also why is it always French leaks anyway? ive noticed that across ALL the games i play...its always a french leak lol

PiñaColada wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Squigbuggy appears to have been both designed and priced by the people in this thread constantly saying that averages don't matter with random combinations of dice rolls.

It appears the design team was perhaps more impressed with the numbers leading the D6 count than their actual casualty output. Because that points cost couldnt have come from play testing.

Perhaps they decided on the price by rolling a d200?

Well done Sir. That earned an IRL chuckle.

I didn't know you could get d1000 but totally explains the Stompa

So sad about the stompa, in this age of gw “listening” to player feedback surely they must understand how badly it is costed, has no one told them?

Unless all the other superheavies are going up in points in ca!

Ugh, my heart sinks since I REALLY want to use the Stompa without completely shooting myself in the foot, but it seems like I'll have to find a narrative game that makes it more palatable to use as usual. I find it baffling that GW can make IK usable, but god forbid a xenos equivalent be anywhere close to the same utility as them.

crzylgs wrote:

And then the gun stops working because that's how GW 'balance' Orks. Fun. Right?

Seriously though, I can't see how it can have enough Dakka to justify 920 points. When currently its not worth even half of that.

The gatling can be either terribad or awesome, it's really total random with the PDB rule but the deffkanon is great and won't stop shooting no?

So with stratagem a shooting phase on the Stompa is:

3D6 gatling shots exploding 5 exploding 6 reroll 1 for bad moons and sees if the gun fire again or not. If it fire again there is still exploding 5 and 6 and reroll 1.

1D6 suppa rokket exploding 5 & 6 reroll 1.

3D6 deffkanon exploding 5 & 6 reroll 1.

We clearly won't be to the damage output of a raven castellan don't make me wrong but it doesn't seem bad either. The thing seems tankier. Close combat is good too but it depend on the health remaining cause the last table is WS6+ and 3A... I don't know it needs testing i think.

i think i would prefer that better version of dakkadakkadakka (lets call it MOAR DAKKA!) on a big unit of snakebite tankbustas. I just find monster hunters too good of a stratagem to pass up.

With two units of 10 shooting a knight, one with MOAR DAKKA! (better be 1 CP like everyone elses shooting stratagems (except grey knight lol..)) popped and also with Monster Hunters. The thing should be going down.

If someone could work out the averages that would be sweet

Come now, boyz. Did anyone really expect geedubz to make stompas usable?

Next you'll be surprised when deff dreads continue to be horrible!

One other thing the French guys said is that there are no bad units in the Codex ... don't know what that means for competitive players though.

How anyone can justify paying 920pts (does this even include weapons) for a stompa is beyond me. Especially seen as the titan weapons of the blades are like 400-500pts and can take down your stompa in 1 turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 nflagey wrote:
One other thing the French guys said is that there are no bad units in the Codex ... don't know what that means for competitive players though.

They say this every time... i never believe them... only thing that might save it for me is that everything else got a huge 25% price cut.

if anyone were to run a stompa, i think the two best clans for it is either bad moons or snakebites.

Reroll 1's to hit with MOAR DAKKA! is ok. But we have yet to find out what their clan stratagem is, if it is the rumoured shoot again ability that would be actually alright. However that boosted DDD could very well be the bad moon stratagem...

Snakebites gives you a bit of extra mileage from your stompa, with an average 6 additional saves throughout the course of the stompas 40 wounds down to 0. You could of course roll more 6+++ or get unlucky and never roll a single 6 but you are also healing D3 wounds on a 2+ as well so you may get more chances to roll those 6's.

The main part of running snakebites for it is once again the Monster Hunters stratagem. getting +1 to wound vs knights, daemon primarchs, tyranid gun beasts/hive tyrants and heavy vehicles like PBC for example is so damn good. Suddenly those dethkannon shots wound anything short of a Walord titan on a 2+. The supa gatler will be wounding most vehicles and daemon primarchs on 2's and the heavier vehicles like knights on 3's and then its big shootas and skorchas on 4's. (havent included the supa rokkit, you get the picture).

Then not only does it affect your stompa but you can fire sluggas, shootas to plink more wounds off on a 5+, big shoota and other str 5/6 weapons on 4's.

I just find that so efficent. Its veterans of the long wars but on a big gribbily you want dead on you whole army for that chosen phase!!!

 TedNugent wrote:

gungo wrote:
Goff is the go to for boy spam w extra hits and skarboys (higher star)
Badmoons is the KMK units
Evil suns or boodaxes will be the core of lost peoples armies depending on what they plan on using..

Remember zhardsnark is still evil suns....

The 2 main questions I have is the trikeboss a vehicle of biker keyword

This is important because a painboy on bike with lukky stick (Goff) gives FNP to bikers...and the lukky stick makes the painboy klaw finally good with a nice aura.

And what’s the price of bikers/nob bikers because bloodaxe bikers might be good again. Especially nob bikers if priced right with BCs.

Characters on a bike other than zhad won't exist. Per KiriothTV.

Also per the same, blood axes may shoot and charge the turn they fell back.

we all know they are not in the codex... but the index is still fair game and relics stil work

I think the It would be cool if the Stompa was 920 points and worth every bit. Like it could just be murder machine from top to bottom.

 Galas wrote:
Only GW could take a horrible mode like the Stompa, give it buffs and make it even more expensive.

GW, if something is really, really bad, you make it cheaper or give it buffs. If you give it buffs and then make it more expensive is like you didn't did anything, unless the buffs are so big the increase in price is deserved.
I doubt it. 920 points. Half an army. I can't see a Stompa being worth that.

It would be really unfortunate. Unless it has some other big buffs there is just no way it can do anything useful. I feel like they would have mentioned that along with the 6 attacks. Even with a KFF on it...just not viable.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Stompa is still over 900pts?
ugh...better have buffed the crap out of it. 40hp sounds like a lot but thats still not that tough to take down when its pretty much the only big thing to fire all the high damage guns at.

Also why is it always French leaks anyway? ive noticed that across ALL the games i play...its always a french leak lol

Or until you realize knight is about as tough with 5++ anyway.

I can only conclude gw plays in enviroment where lascannons shoot at infantry and heavybolters at vehicles.

But yeah guess i transfer model purchaces to AT instead.

Psychocouac wrote:

crzylgs wrote:

And then the gun stops working because that's how GW 'balance' Orks. Fun. Right?

Seriously though, I can't see how it can have enough Dakka to justify 920 points. When currently its not worth even half of that.

The gatling can be either terribad or awesome, it's really total random with the PDB rule but the deffkanon is great and won't stop shooting no?

So with stratagem a shooting phase on the Stompa is:

3D6 gatling shots exploding 5 exploding 6 reroll 1 for bad moons and sees if the gun fire again or not. If it fire again there is still exploding 5 and 6 and reroll 1.

1D6 suppa rokket exploding 5 & 6 reroll 1.

3D6 deffkanon exploding 5 & 6 reroll 1.

We clearly won't be to the damage output of a raven castellan don't make me wrong but it doesn't seem bad either. The thing seems tankier. Close combat is good too but it depend on the health remaining cause the last table is WS6+ and 3A... I don't know it needs testing i think.

If I understand this correctly - there is a stratagem that makes DakkaDakkaDakka trigger on 5s instead of 6s? If so, that will be incredible (in general).

Obi_wang wrote:
I think the It would be cool if the Stompa was 920 points and worth every bit. Like it could just be murder machine from top to bottom.

A) doesn'' look like it is worth it
B) stompa is orks knight equilavent. Not warhound. It shouldn't be 1000 pts model. It's one ork war machine you should be able to take multiples like knights

*sigh* death skulls tomorrow

I hope there's something in there aside from 6++ and the "snazzwagon" to make them worth painting everything that admittedly fantastic color scheme.

tneva82 wrote:

Obi_wang wrote:
I think the It would be cool if the Stompa was 920 points and worth every bit. Like it could just be murder machine from top to bottom.

A) doesn'' look like it is worth it
B) stompa is orks knight equilavent. Not warhound. It shouldn't be 1000 pts model. It's one ork war machine you should be able to take multiples like knights

I'm not trying to say it is, but saying it could be cool if there was a model that cost 900 points and was worth it.

At least make such modei be one that should be around that price rather than one such as stompa where squadron of them should be possible.

 TedNugent wrote:
*sigh* death skulls tomorrow

I hope there's something in there aside from 6++ and the "snazzwagon" to make them worth painting everything that admittedly fantastic color scheme.

Shocker would be a looted wagon strategem!!!
I’m not even sure how they could make that work lol

gungo wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
*sigh* death skulls tomorrow

I hope there's something in there aside from 6++ and the "snazzwagon" to make them worth painting everything that admittedly fantastic color scheme.

Shocker would be a looted wagon strategem!!!
I’m not even sure how they could make that work lol

I sure would be nice but the Blood Axes would ask for it also!
Looted/traded wagon that is.

I would be a happy camper If i could use this nice looted rhino
kit from FW here and there...

I don't know how that would work...You suddenly get to play with somebody else's model? I've run into some folk that could get a little tetchy with that....

 JimOnMars wrote:
I don't know how that would work...You suddenly get to play with somebody else's model? I've run into some folk that could get a little tetchy with that....

No; it stops being their model when you take it.

 JimOnMars wrote:
I don't know how that would work...You suddenly get to play with somebody else's model? I've run into some folk that could get a little tetchy with that....

Rather changes stats of your existing model. Or would be entry in codex with mandatory cp usage which would be silly

I definitelly don't agree about Stompa being on the knight level. Have you seen the damn thing? It's about twice as big, so the price is also about twice as big. It could be worth it at about 650-700 points with the current stats. Then it'd be comparable to a Castellan(without 3++ ofc). However it might get a cool "add +1 to hit rolls for ORK unit" stratagem or something and might go off the rails, we don't know yet.

Size!=power. Stompa has always been squadronable swarm unit more comparable to land raider than warhound. It only got to this level in latest go when it became thing in 40k where designers mixed up stompa with mekboy gargant which is ork equilavent to warhound.

A good thing is that the billowing exhaust fumes stratagem is for all orks, not just Evil sunz. Same goes for the speedwaagh. I'm still waiting for the Bad moons stratagem to be reveal, otherwise its probably goffs that i'm most excited.

Got my SpeedFreeks box!! If anybody wants info, just ask.

Here is a comment on the size of the sprues. Yes, the sprues are big ... they are twice the size of a "regular one" (e.g. a warbiker one). On the red buggy, it seems like it could easily be split in two parts however and there is a flash mark right in the middle. On the yellow buggy, it's a bit more tricky, but not impossible to have it on 2 regular sprues.

Here is another one on customization: it seems impossible to switch parts without some work. Nothing too difficult I imagine, by looking at the sprues. The assembly book shows no options at all, except for the warbikers of course. The datacards don't show any options either for the two buggies.

Points: PL6 for the Shokkjump Dragstas (up to 3 per squadron), PL5 for the Kustom Boosta-Blastas (up to 3 per squadron).

 nflagey wrote:
Got my SpeedFreeks box!! If anybody wants info, just ask.

Here is a comment on the size of the sprues. Yes, the sprues are big ... they are twice the size of a "regular one" (e.g. a warbiker one). On the red buggy, it seems like it could easily be split in two parts however and there is a flash mark right in the middle. On the yellow buggy, it's a bit more tricky, but not impossible to have it on 2 regular sprues.

Here is another one on customization: it seems impossible to switch parts without some work. Nothing too difficult I imagine, by looking at the sprues. The assembly book shows no options at all, except for the warbikers of course. The datacards don't show any options either for the two buggies.

Points: PL6 for the Shokkjump Dragstas (up to 3 per squadron), PL5 for the Kustom Boosta-Blastas (up to 3 per squadron).

What's your opinion on the terrain? A lot of people have stated that it's amazing but doesn't come across well on camera

Terrain is good. Six big pieces, with lots of diversity on them: tires, pieces of dakkajet/trukk/wagon, tools, ork symbols, imperial symbol, lightbulbs dangling in the wind, ...

They fill 2 regular sprues, to give you an idea of the size.

Three pieces have to be put flat, while the other three are on their side, if you see what I mean.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The driver of the red buggy is definitely a cybork by the way.
We could see his spine (kind of necron-like) on some pictures already. Both arms also show mechanical parts.

Another general comment: it's weird to see sprues in brown, red, and yellow (first time for me). The yellow one is really giving me a sense of lack of details (just an impression of course)

 Spreelock wrote:
A good thing is that the billowing exhaust fumes stratagem is for all orks, not just Evil sunz. Same goes for the speedwaagh. I'm still waiting for the Bad moons stratagem to be reveal, otherwise its probably goffs that i'm most excited.

Problem is it's speed freak only and triggered at the start of movement phase so in terms of usability it's inferior to rotate ion shield which already is dubious use except when fielding lone knight as ally. Problem will be that a) vehicles will be 1 model units which aren't really that super units you would want to definitely protect one specific b) enemy can simply skip it and shoot another. As there's no "protect this one at all cost" like castellan with knights it's not even much of a hindrance for enemy...

Pretty much custom made for units of 12 bikes. Though doesn't look those got enough boost that they would be worth it even for this. Now if battlewagon gets speed freak tag...

Another case of non-scalability of strategems kicking orks in the teeth. Ork army building style and strategems don't really synergy when orks works by overloading enemy with target saturation while strategems work by buffing one unit. Exact opposite styles...

If the points are as stated by the French war game studio I have a few concerns.

The stompa looks vastly overcosted unless it has some stats and abilities that we haven't seen. I'm sure we''ve seen the rule for PDB by the way, it was in a preview and allows the gun to fire again on a 2+. I'm still not seeing almost 1k pts of value.

The buggies are also too expensive and their costing makes little sense. The KBB at 5 PL is more expensive in points than the SJD at 6 PL? What?

110 pts is usable for the SJD but its hardly efficient. 120 for the KBB is too expensive. The Squig Buggy will be the worst selling of the buggies I suspect because its far too expensive.

I wonder if bikes have had the substantial price reduction they needed. It wasn't mentioned in the Evil Sunz article so I'm not sure.

Well, I was considering it for nobz on bikes, to make them more resilient. Yeah, it is definately good if battlewagon gets speed freak keyword.

 Spreelock wrote:
Well, I was considering it for nobz on bikes, to make them more resilient. Yeah, it is definately good if battlewagon gets speed freak keyword.

I think it was stated somewhere which all the units with keywords speedfreeks were. I think it's just the new buggies, bikes and deffkoptas. Not planes, trukks nor battlewagons. Maybe it was answered on facebook or something, I honestly don't remember right now

I hope bikers will be viable. I could see them getting a constant -1 to hit because of all the dust and exhaust fumes. Just like the admech dragoons. They used to have constant cover because of this a few editions ago.

PiñaColada wrote:

 Spreelock wrote:
Well, I was considering it for nobz on bikes, to make them more resilient. Yeah, it is definately good if battlewagon gets speed freak keyword.

I think it was stated somewhere which all the units with keywords speedfreeks were. I think it's just the new buggies, bikes and deffkoptas. Not planes, trukks nor battlewagons. Maybe it was answered on facebook or something, I honestly don't remember right now

Correct. They stated in the comments that the article named all the units with the Speed Freeks tag - bikes, koptas and the new buggies. Not planes, trukks or bwagons.

By the way, I saw someone here ask about Looted Wagons.

The French guys talked about them briefly and said they were not in the Codex. I guess this is not really a surprise.

Psychocouac, tu confirmes?

 Spreelock wrote:
Well, I was considering it for nobz on bikes, to make them more resilient. Yeah, it is definately good if battlewagon gets speed freak keyword.

Oh right those exists too! They are so lol bad I entirely forgot they even were in codex Well if they have the tag then yeah full(or at least big) unit of those would be also worth it. Suitably death starry for strategems.

edit: Oh drat noticed yet another NERF on stompa...Degration chart just got worse. Rather than S degrading it's now A...And since S is the one you are least going to miss...Basically by the time you get to combat your new improved A value has degraded into state of same or worse as before. And "funnily" enough if anything orks are the ones that should be least degrading rather than stompa being hurt by degration even more than say imperial knights. Ugh.

edit2: And FW made necron walker rules that are much more playable(though wouldn't consider that as auto include even then...). Sigh. Puts stompa at shame, costs 66% of stompa and still isn't auto include.

 nflagey wrote:
By the way, I saw someone here ask about Looted Wagons.

The French guys talked about them briefly and said they were not in the Codex. I guess this is not really a surprise.

Psychocouac, tu confirmes?

Yes, not in the codex.

Knights, Deathguard; Strategem, Guarantees explosion, no roll.
Orks; Strategem, Explodes on a 5+ instead of 6+!

If that’s true - come on.

Also, I love how the reality that this codex, despite being hyped/"worked on" for long, is beginning to sink in that it’s rhe exact same as other codecii - in that the writing is poor, unit prices/values are off, and it could honestly end up anywhere from top of pack, to more likely, lower in the pack rankings.

Evil Sunz and teleport strategems only thing holding the codex together from the sounds of it; boyz are nerfed, vehicles are overpriced, shooting is still equally poor (although more open to different BS values than 5+), stratagems largely unapplicable, and so on...

Hitting on 6+ always is a nice touch though; but I’ll be honest, I’m expecting that to be a base game rule in he upcoming CA.

Worst part is knowing that we’ll have to wait a year to see any hope of updated/improved points pricing on models, since we’re being released too close to CA2018.

I’m sure between Evil Sunz; Da Jump, Stormboyz, and 20pl teleport stratagem; we’ll still be a competitive army - but it’ll largely be the same play style as now (albeit reduced ability to green tide in number); but all the fun/fluffy units, aka the best ones, will largely remain unviable.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
I don't know how that would work...You suddenly get to play with somebody else's model? I've run into some folk that could get a little tetchy with that....

No; it stops being their model when you take it.

Permanently!

fe40k wrote:
Knights, Deathguard; Strategem, Guarantees explosion, no roll.
Orks; Strategem, Explodes on a 5+ instead of 6+!

If that’s true - come on.

Also, I love how the reality that this codex, despite being hyped/"worked on" for long, is beginning to sink in that it’s rhe exact same as other codecii - in that the writing is poor, unit prices/values are off, and it could honestly end up anywhere from top of pack, to more likely, lower in the pack rankings.

Evil Sunz and teleport strategems only thing holding the codex together from the sounds of it; boyz are nerfed, vehicles are overpriced, shooting is still equally poor (although more open to different BS values than 5+), stratagems largely unapplicable, and so on...

Hitting on 6+ always is a nice touch though; but I’ll be honest, I’m expecting that to be a base game rule in he upcoming CA.

Worst part is knowing that we’ll have to wait a year to see any hope of updated/improved points pricing on models, since we’re being released too close to CA2018.

I’m sure between Evil Sunz; Da Jump, Stormboyz, and 20pl teleport stratagem; we’ll still be a competitive army - but it’ll largely be the same play style as now (albeit reduced ability to green tide in number); but all the fun/fluffy units, aka the best ones, will largely remain unviable.

The knight stratagem is explodes on a 4+ for 2CP. On the new knights they roll 2 die and if either is a 6+ (or 4+ with the strat) it blows up. If both are 6+/4+ it blows up bigger

i was hoping for a sensible stompa price decrease, but im not surprised by what we are getting.

im gonna try to stay hopeful for other pt decreases for other units. until then im not getting too disappointed by the inevitable worthless stompa (was there an edition it was actually good? besides the cheap bigmek stompa of 7th lol).

and no offence to the french youtuber who is being awesome by leaking this stuff, but unless he runs orks for his primary army and hes played the stompa against any army that is good against hvy armor, then im not gonna take his word on how good the over costed stompa is (i didn't believe when reece said it, im not gonna believe it here).

Not Happy.

Its horses for courses i'd love to run my tac marine focused army with land speeders and such at a tourney but it wouldn't survive past turn 1.

most tournament armies i see are a tiny variation on the same theme across factions. Like chaos oh look another morty, and plague drones of etc etc

its not what gw wanted to do with 8th but its the reality.

geargutz wrote:
i was hoping for a sensible stompa price decrease, but im not surprised by what we are getting.

im gonna try to stay hopeful for other pt decreases for other units. until then im not getting too disappointed by the inevitable worthless stompa (was there an edition it was actually good? besides the cheap bigmek stompa of 7th lol).

and no offence to the french youtuber who is being awesome by leaking this stuff, but unless he runs orks for his primary army and hes played the stompa against any army that is good against hvy armor, then im not gonna take his word on how good the over costed stompa is (i didn't believe when reece said it, im not gonna believe it here).

I'd agree with you ... the leaks were ... well, leaked ... during a very brief AAQ right after they demoed Speed Freeks.
It was not a thought through analysis of points/power balance at all.
Whether or not he's an ork player was not really relevant in that context.
So yeah, I would not assume his view on the Stompa or other units are those of a competitive ork player

fe40k wrote:
Knights, Deathguard; Strategem, Guarantees explosion, no roll.
Orks; Strategem, Explodes on a 5+ instead of 6+!

Hum. I thought the exploding thing referred to 6's causing more shots rather than dying on explosion? Or did I misunderstand something.

Also, I love how the reality that this codex, despite being hyped/"worked on" for long, is beginning to sink in that it’s rhe exact same as other codecii - in that the writing is poor, unit prices/values are off, and it could honestly end up anywhere from top of pack, to more likely, lower in the pack rankings.

[ ] surprised.

PiñaColada wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Knights, Deathguard; Strategem, Guarantees explosion, no roll.
Orks; Strategem, Explodes on a 5+ instead of 6+!

If that’s true - come on.

Also, I love how the reality that this codex, despite being hyped/"worked on" for long, is beginning to sink in that it’s rhe exact same as other codecii - in that the writing is poor, unit prices/values are off, and it could honestly end up anywhere from top of pack, to more likely, lower in the pack rankings.

Evil Sunz and teleport strategems only thing holding the codex together from the sounds of it; boyz are nerfed, vehicles are overpriced, shooting is still equally poor (although more open to different BS values than 5+), stratagems largely unapplicable, and so on...

Hitting on 6+ always is a nice touch though; but I’ll be honest, I’m expecting that to be a base game rule in he upcoming CA.

Worst part is knowing that we’ll have to wait a year to see any hope of updated/improved points pricing on models, since we’re being released too close to CA2018.

I’m sure between Evil Sunz; Da Jump, Stormboyz, and 20pl teleport stratagem; we’ll still be a competitive army - but it’ll largely be the same play style as now (albeit reduced ability to green tide in number); but all the fun/fluffy units, aka the best ones, will largely remain unviable.

The knight stratagem is explodes on a 4+ for 2CP. On the new knights they roll 2 die and if either is a 6+ (or 4+ with the strat) it blows up. If both are 6+/4+ it blows up bigger

Hmm, I eat my words then.

I looked up the Death Guard one, and it was an automatic explosion; so I figured the big knights would be as well - which seems weird that it’s not, since there’s even less of them than Death Guard vehicles, and they’re so big...

I suppose that it might be balanced out since the big ones can have a larger explosion, depending how to roll.

I’m not sold on a +1 to explosion roll for +1 cp (which it has to close, right?); but maybe it’ll have its use in a niche situation - better to have it as an option, then not have it, I guess.

tneva82 wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Knights, Deathguard; Strategem, Guarantees explosion, no roll.
Orks; Strategem, Explodes on a 5+ instead of 6+!

Hum. I thought the exploding thing referred to 6's causing more shots rather than dying on explosion? Or did I misunderstand something.

You are right. I re explain:

Rule DakkaDakkaDakka: you won't hit worse than 6+ and 6+ generates an other hit roll.

New stratagem (moar dakka!): you won't hit worse than 5+ and 5+ generates an other hit roll.

The moar dakka strat is basically what I think the bad moons rule should have been instead, just for simplicity's sake

i really hope orkz get a surprise lieutenant in the codex. Something like a boss nob that scares the boys into fighting harder giving reroll 1's to wound in close combat like the CSM aspiring champion?

Thats what orkz are missing, some character synergy. Yes we have KFF Big Mekz, Painboyz, Banner Nobz and Warbosses but we need something else.

Hey even the little Mek could grant reroll 1's to wound for Mek Guns and Vehicles. All of sudden he isnt trash anymore!!!


****like when dark angels got their Talon Master, it wasnt expected and hes actually quite good!****

I'm rather glad if they DON'T give rerolls. Those slow down. 8th ed is already slower than any edition in years. If they want boost things have rather modifiers. +1 to wound and more pricey or something. Orks already roll tons of dices. I already am rushing things enough without even more rerolls to the mix.

tneva82 wrote:
I'm rather glad if they DON'T give rerolls. Those slow down. 8th ed is already slower than any edition in years. If they want boost things have rather modifiers. +1 to wound and more pricey or something. Orkz already roll tons of dices. I already am rushing things enough without even more rerolls to the mix.

+1 to wound would be silly on things on like KMK's. Reroll 1's are fine. For a battery of 5 Mek Gunz it doesnt slow down the game that much. I play Admech as well as Dark Eldar and they have rerolls coming from all over the place and it has never slowed down my turn. In fact my opponents take longer with there turns than i do with mine.

I know all my weapons and rules and i know my opponents army too. I rarely have to flick through my codex or my opponents and i am quite good at guessing how many dice i need to roll in my opponents turn. With all this combined i quite frequently finish before time is called.

And it is the same when i play my Orkz. Orkz dont roll a tonne of dice in the shooting phase compared to most armies, regularly ive seen people roll more dice in the shooting phase than us. The slowest phase of the game for us is the movement phase which can be offset by movement trays and a billion combat gauges everywhere to plan ahead

The slowest game ive ever had was vs a guilliman gunline. Took him forever to decide what to shoot his twin assault cannons at and then when he did it was just a wave of dice then rerolls then dice thrown again with more rerolls.

Quite often i find people with gun lines take longer turns.

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
I'm rather glad if they DON'T give rerolls. Those slow down. 8th ed is already slower than any edition in years. If they want boost things have rather modifiers. +1 to wound and more pricey or something. Orkz already roll tons of dices. I already am rushing things enough without even more rerolls to the mix.

+1 to wound would be silly on things on like KMK's. Reroll 1's are fine. For a battery of 5 Mek Gunz it doesnt slow down the game that much. I play Admech as well as Dark Eldar and they have rerolls coming from all over the place and it has never slowed down my turn. In fact my opponents take longer with there turns than i do with mine.

And you don't think that reroll HQ wouldn't be used to reroll for 30+ boyz mobs etc? Unsurprisingly those are where rerolls would help most as you would be rolling tons of dices.

Simple fact of the matter is it takes more time with rerolls. There's no way up or down of it. Oh and silly? Let's see. KMK vs knight, with reroll 1's goes to 7 wounds, with +1 to wound goes to 8 wounds. Is that 1 really THAT silly? Especially when obviously the aura would be buffed accordingly.

BTW funny how you mentioned KMK as "silly" as that's actually on the worse units to use +1 to wound for. You know where it actually would be waaaay more powerful? Basic S4 boy vs anything with T8. And yes +1 to wound would be better aura. That's why I say price the aura up. I have no qualms paying more for better ability. Games not played to the end sucks though.

tneva82 wrote:
edit: Oh drat noticed yet another NERF on stompa...Degration chart just got worse. Rather than S degrading it's now A...And since S is the one you are least going to miss...Basically by the time you get to combat your new improved A value has degraded into state of same or worse as before. And "funnily" enough if anything orks are the ones that should be least degrading rather than stompa being hurt by degration even more than say imperial knights. Ugh.

Degrading Attacks is worse than degrading Strength, but in this case they have given the Stompa two more attacks to start with so it's not until the last bracket that the Stompa has less attacks than it had in the index.

I still wonder how long it would take the enti titan weapons to kill the new stompa.

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
I'm rather glad if they DON'T give rerolls. Those slow down. 8th ed is already slower than any edition in years. If they want boost things have rather modifiers. +1 to wound and more pricey or something. Orkz already roll tons of dices. I already am rushing things enough without even more rerolls to the mix.

+1 to wound would be silly on things on like KMK's. Reroll 1's are fine. For a battery of 5 Mek Gunz it doesnt slow down the game that much. I play Admech as well as Dark Eldar and they have rerolls coming from all over the place and it has never slowed down my turn. In fact my opponents take longer with there turns than i do with mine.

And you don't think that reroll HQ wouldn't be used to reroll for 30+ boyz mobs etc? Unsurprisingly those are where rerolls would help most as you would be rolling tons of dices.

Simple fact of the matter is it takes more time with rerolls. There's no way up or down of it. Oh and silly? Let's see. KMK vs knight, with reroll 1's goes to 7 wounds, with +1 to wound goes to 8 wounds. Is that 1 really THAT silly? Especially when obviously the aura would be buffed accordingly.

BTW funny how you mentioned KMK as "silly" as that's actually on the worse units to use +1 to wound for. You know where it actually would be waaaay more powerful? Basic S4 boy vs anything with T8. And yes +1 to wound would be better aura. That's why I say price the aura up. I have no qualms paying more for better ability. Games not played to the end sucks though.

I did mention a Boss Nob / Overseer that could reroll 1's to wound for close combat..... like how CSM have there Aspiring Champion and then i mentioned that the Mek could grant reroll 1's to wound for Mek Gunz and vehicles..... so you just agreed with what i said as i mentioned 2 possible units that could provide an aura that would be useful but affects different parts of the army.

A +1 to wound makes KMKs wound T7 and below on a 2+ and T8 on a 3+. If you had this made up character squat next to 18 Mek Guns and they were all bad moons (even though they are BS4) youd be destroying everything left right and centre. You are getting 8-9 KMKs for a Knight and around 14 for a Castellan. And even ages targets that arent knights your still going to murder everything with a +1 to wound.

Off the back of your hand how many units out there provide a +1 to wound? I can think of units that reroll 1's to wound like necron lords, lieutenants, aspiring champions (in combat), guilliman.... none add +1 to wound (although guilliman is pretty close to it with reroll fails).

Stratagem wise we have Veterans of the long war, masterful marksmenship, a couple of deathwatch stratagems vs select targets and monster hunters?

Feel free to add on those lists.

In tournaments i have attended i rarely come across knights. I have played against the BA, IG and Castellan list before and i dismantled it with my Dark Eldar. Just because its the meta doesnt mean that list is invincible. Ive seen many players use odd ball lists and rank top 5 very often as people dont expect these lists.

Trying something different is good and i imagine the Ork community will be the same, everyone here is unique in there play styles and that is an Orky trait.

I was simply providing my thoughts on how to upgrade certain parts of our army roster that doesnt make is OMG OP EVERYONE MUST SPAM AND TAKE ONLY TO TOURNAMENTS.

There have been quite a few good points made by people on this thread and the two others and its been interesting seeing their point of view and what they want to run, but there has also been some people who just instantly shut down these people and tell them how bad there ideas are and just being all negative.

That needs to stop. If you dont agree with what someone has posted be nice and leave it be, dont punish them for not being uber competitive.

Ork players are diverse, dont force them to be or play in a way they dont enjoy. Everyone has there own successes no matter how small like local tournaments or how big at GTs.

Honestly, I've had 1k points of orks die to 1 knight before... I've entered a few tournaments with speed freaks and out biggest problem I found was that we just didn't have the damage output and survivability.

I would fire my Morkanout, finally get 1 shot and role a 1 and get 1 wound after taking 1 mortal wound myself. XD They would fire like double my shots, hit them all with BS and rerolls. It just seemed in my mechanised list that they had more than I did... Was hoping this would change and my 2k points would go down to 1,500 or something so i could fit more trukks and wagon in.

 lolman1c wrote:
Honestly, I've had 1k points of orks die to 1 knight before... I've entered a few tournaments with speed freaks and out biggest problem I found was that we just didn't have the damage output and survivability.

I would fire my Morkanout, finally get 1 shot and role a 1 and get 1 wound after taking 1 mortal wound myself. XD They would fire like double my shots, hit them all with BS and rerolls. It just seemed in my mechanised list that they had more than I did... Was hoping this would change and my 2k points would go down to 1,500 or something so i could fit more trukks and wagon in.

My morkanaut is so bad in its history, the gorkanaut has always done better

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
I'm rather glad if they DON'T give rerolls. Those slow down. 8th ed is already slower than any edition in years. If they want boost things have rather modifiers. +1 to wound and more pricey or something. Orkz already roll tons of dices. I already am rushing things enough without even more rerolls to the mix.

+1 to wound would be silly on things on like KMK's. Reroll 1's are fine. For a battery of 5 Mek Gunz it doesnt slow down the game that much. I play Admech as well as Dark Eldar and they have rerolls coming from all over the place and it has never slowed down my turn. In fact my opponents take longer with there turns than i do with mine.

And you don't think that reroll HQ wouldn't be used to reroll for 30+ boyz mobs etc? Unsurprisingly those are where rerolls would help most as you would be rolling tons of dices.

Simple fact of the matter is it takes more time with rerolls. There's no way up or down of it. Oh and silly? Let's see. KMK vs knight, with reroll 1's goes to 7 wounds, with +1 to wound goes to 8 wounds. Is that 1 really THAT silly? Especially when obviously the aura would be buffed accordingly.

BTW funny how you mentioned KMK as "silly" as that's actually on the worse units to use +1 to wound for. You know where it actually would be waaaay more powerful? Basic S4 boy vs anything with T8. And yes +1 to wound would be better aura. That's why I say price the aura up. I have no qualms paying more for better ability. Games not played to the end sucks though.

I did mention a Boss Nob / Overseer that could reroll 1's to wound for close combat..... like how CSM have there Aspiring Champion and then i mentioned that the Mek could grant reroll 1's to wound for Mek Gunz and vehicles..... so you just agreed with what i said as i mentioned 2 possible units that could provide an aura that would be useful but affects different parts of the army.

A +1 to wound makes KMKs wound T7 and below on a 2+ and T8 on a 3+. If you had this made up character squat next to 18 Mek Guns and they were all bad moons (even though they are BS4) youd be destroying everything left right and centre. You are getting 8-9 KMKs for a Knight and around 14 for a Castellan. And even ages targets that arent knights your still going to murder everything with a +1 to wound.

Off the back of your hand how many units out there provide a +1 to wound? I can think of units that reroll 1's to wound like necron lords, lieutenants, aspiring champions (in combat), guilliman.... none add +1 to wound (although guilliman is pretty close to it with reroll fails).

Stratagem wise we have Veterans of the long war, masterful marksmenship, a couple of deathwatch stratagems vs select targets and monster hunters?

Feel free to add on those lists.

In tournaments i have attended i rarely come across knights. I have played against the BA, IG and Castellan list before and i dismantled it with my Dark Eldar. Just because its the meta doesnt mean that list is invincible. Ive seen many players use odd ball lists and rank top 5 very often as people dont expect these lists.

Trying something different is good and i imagine the Ork community will be the same, everyone here is unique in there play styles and that is an Orky trait.

I was simply providing my thoughts on how to upgrade certain parts of our army roster that doesnt make is OMG OP EVERYONE MUST SPAM AND TAKE ONLY TO TOURNAMENTS.

There have been quite a few good points made by people on this thread and the two others and its been interesting seeing their point of view and what they want to run, but there has also been some people who just instantly shut down these people and tell them how bad there ideas are and just being all negative.

That needs to stop. If you dont agree with what someone has posted be nice and leave it be, dont punish them for not being uber competitive.

Ork players are diverse, dont force them to be or play in a way they dont enjoy. Everyone has there own successes no matter how small like local tournaments or how big at GTs.

Kmk benfits less from modifier to wounds than boyz. That's mathematical fact that cannot be denied. It also has minimal difference to reroll 1's to wounds. That's also mathematical fact. It's also fact rerolls take more time to resolve than modifier. Only anybody who doesn't think about it even 1 second would claim otherwise.

Now do you want slower or faster method is to each. I would see more faster methods rather than rerolls. Gw loves rerolls but that doesn't make it good. Actually if gw likes something it's often opposite!

Funny that others might disagree with you and want other kinds of buffs. I'm sure you are such an special case your word is final on what kind of buffs should be applied.

Btw 18 kmk shot vs t7 with reroll 16 wounds. Kmk same target with +1 to wound 12 wounds. How it would be so ridiculous? It's worse buff than reroll for kmk vs t7!

This is big problem with people. They make claims without doing elementary school math that would show does claim hold water

Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.

Let's go through this mess....

Stompa: 920 points 40 wounds

vs

2 Shadowswords: 808 points 52 wounds

Turn 1: (stompa goes first)

1 damage from super gat
7 damage from deffkannon

total, 8 damage to 1 Shadow

Shadowsword turn 1:

4 damage from heavy bolters

73 wounds from the two Volcano Cannons...

-_-

We played another game when the stompa was charge range... He got 1 shadowsword down to about 10 wounds but then they both just pulled back and did 52 wounds to him.

Anyone else feel this release was a bit poop?

Not exactly a crazy month for Orks seeing how half of it wasnt even Orks.

and.. well.. not exactly a massive amount of models either.

Jacob29 wrote:
Anyone else feel this release was a bit poop?

Not exactly a crazy month for Orks seeing how half of it wasnt even Orks.

and.. well.. not exactly a massive amount of models either.

The models are more than I could have hoped for... it's just the rest of the codex needs fixing as well.

My solution to tough target is snakebite tankbustas.

2 unit of 10 with 2 squigs in each

Or

2 units of 15 with 6 squigs in each

 lolman1c wrote:
Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.
.

Well to be fair shadowsword is specialised big model killer while stompa is more generalist so should be matchup. But gap is still too large. New necron walker is better, costs 620 or so and is still non competive...

Btw did stompa use exploding 5 strat and bad moon trait? Probably only sensible combo.

Oh and stompa got nerfed in degrade table...wonder how gw thinks anything about stompa needed nerf

tneva82 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.
.

Well to be fair shadowsword is specialised big model killer while stompa is more generalist so should be matchup. But gap is still too large. New necron walker is better, costs 620 or so and is still non competive...

Btw did stompa use exploding 5 strat and bad moon trait? Probably only sensible combo.

Oh and stompa got nerfed in degrade table...wonder how gw thinks anything about stompa needed nerf

I mean I don't think it really matters... any 2 Blade variant has more wounds, less points and does more than 7 damage to the stompa with extremely high range guns. But I think a good game would be Stompa vs the new knight. Might have to try that out later today.

 deffrekka wrote:
I just don't play like a snail

Neither do i. Good luck on opponents watching my dice roll. Doesn't help much when rules are so slow that what used to be easy 2k in 2h became impossibie.

Slower rules isn't good thing. But hey somebody who thinks buff that gives you 25% less wounds than other makes things ridiculously good...lol. worse buff making things worse. Your credibility is pretty low with that.

The big issue with the stompa other than points (assuming they are indeed 920) is just that degrade table. I don't get why it degrades more than twice. Usually big stuff degrades at 50% health and then again at 25%, those numbers scale so why even add more? Just remove the last bracket in terms of nerfs it gets, and spread it out according to everything else.

But yeah, facing it off against a castellan or shadowsword is going to make it look worse than it is since they are specialised titanic hunters

 lolman1c wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.
.

Well to be fair shadowsword is specialised big model killer while stompa is more generalist so should be matchup. But gap is still too large. New necron walker is better, costs 620 or so and is still non competive...

Btw did stompa use exploding 5 strat and bad moon trait? Probably only sensible combo.

Oh and stompa got nerfed in degrade table...wonder how gw thinks anything about stompa needed nerf

I mean I don't think it really matters... any 2 Blade variant has more wounds, less points and does more than 7 damage to the stompa with extremely high range guns. But I think a good game would be Stompa vs the new knight. Might have to try that out later today.

If by new knight you mean castelian don't bother. It's premium vehicle buster. It can go walker to tank vs 2 shadowsword that goes first and win. Stompa? Lunch

 lolman1c wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.
.

Well to be fair shadowsword is specialised big model killer while stompa is more generalist so should be matchup. But gap is still too large. New necron walker is better, costs 620 or so and is still non competive...

Btw did stompa use exploding 5 strat and bad moon trait? Probably only sensible combo.

Oh and stompa got nerfed in degrade table...wonder how gw thinks anything about stompa needed nerf

I mean I don't think it really matters... any 2 Blade variant has more wounds, less points and does more than 7 damage to the stompa with extremely high range guns. But I think a good game would be Stompa vs the new knight. Might have to try that out later today.

Try a stompa against 2 knights (but not the castellan which is specialised against heavy stuff and shine against a stompa. And is a bit underpriced too.) Like 2 errants for example.

PiñaColada wrote:
The big issue with the stompa other than points (assuming they are indeed 920) is just that degrade table. I don't get why it degrades more than twice. Usually big stuff degrades at 50% health and then again at 25%, those numbers scale so why even add more? Just remove the last bracket in terms of nerfs it gets, and spread it out according to everything else.

But yeah, facing it off against a castellan or shadowsword is going to make it look worse than it is since they are specialised titanic hunters

Guess gw thinks anything with 40+ wounds should do that. Gw seems to think it's small titan like warhound(which btw degrades similarly) when it's closer to knight class.

More gradual degrade makes sense with something like warlord but stompa is too small for that. And orks are ones you would expect to be less hindered by degrade!

And stompa degrade got worse...

PiñaColada wrote:
The big issue with the stompa other than points (assuming they are indeed 920) is just that degrade table. I don't get why it degrades more than twice. Usually big stuff degrades at 50% health and then again at 25%, those numbers scale so why even add more? Just remove the last bracket in terms of nerfs it gets, and spread it out according to everything else.

But yeah, facing it off against a castellan or shadowsword is going to make it look worse than it is since they are specialised titanic hunters

Pretty much everything with 30+ wounds has additional levels of degradation. It's just that these units tend to be in FW books rather than codexes. It's consistent with units like the Harridan and Warhound titan, both of which have fewer than 40 wounds.

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:
I just don't play like a snail

Neither do i. Good luck on opponents watching my dice roll. Doesn't help much when rules are so slow that what used to be easy 2k in 2h became impossibie.

Slower rules isn't good thing. But hey somebody who thinks buff that gives you 25% less wounds than other makes things ridiculously good...lol. worse buff making things worse. Your credibility is pretty low with that.

Speaking of credibility, where is yours? All you do is shut people down through this thread and the ork tactics thread too.

You think giving buffs to boys is better than giving buffs to other units in the codex. If all you want to use is boys go ahead, many people don't want to just keep spamming greentide to remain semi competitive.

Try helping the community instead of being toxic and constantly bringing up knights every 5 seconds.

Orkz struggle vs vehicles of all shapes and sizes not just the boogeyman of the castellan.

Provide solutions to this problem that doesn't involve mob it with boys then your credibility will be alot better.

If you want to carry this on, PM and we can discuss the pros and cons of different strategies we can use against knights.

I've already expressed mine which is snakebite tank bustas deepstriking with da jump and tellyport, popping more dakka and monsterhunters at the castellan on a 3++

You can try work out the damage but they are cheaper than the knight

Oh okay, then that's fair I guess. Never actually bothered to look at the titans. It's still rough but at least there's some consistency.

Let's just hope the stompa get a lot of special rules added. I don't own one nor do I want to but it's a shame when an army's centerpiece model is basically a glorified paperweight. I don't mind the fact that it's not just an orky imperial knight but I'm skeptical GW will give it enough impact to be worth spending almost half your points in.

I don't even know where they'd start. For sure just give it a 5++ against shooting built in, maybe some buffs for nearby ork models? Give it ramshackle? Reroll everything in CC?

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:
I just don't play like a snail

Neither do i. Good luck on opponents watching my dice roll. Doesn't help much when rules are so slow that what used to be easy 2k in 2h became impossibie.

Slower rules isn't good thing. But hey somebody who thinks buff that gives you 25% less wounds than other makes things ridiculously good...lol. worse buff making things worse. Your credibility is pretty low with that.

Speaking of credibility, where is yours? All you do is shut people down through this thread and the ork tactics thread too.

You think giving buffs to boys is better than giving buffs to other units in the codex. If all you want to use is boys go ahead, many people don't want to just keep spamming greentide to remain semi competitive.

Try helping the community instead of being toxic and constantly bringing up knights every 5 seconds.

Orkz struggle vs vehicles of all shapes and sizes not just the boogeyman of the castellan.

Provide solutions to this problem that doesn't involve mob it with boys then your credibility will be alot better.

If you want to carry this on, PM and we can discuss the pros and cons of different strategies we can use against knights.

I've already expressed mine which is snakebite tank bustas deepstriking with da jump and tellyport, popping more dakka and monsterhunters which deals 9 unsaved wounds to a castellan on a 3++ so 27 damage before squigs and is cheaper than said knight

You provide buffs that are slow, i say i would prefer buff that isn't as fast, you claim it would be ridiculously broken good because it'" 25% worse than your buff. Lol. I look at math and logic. You just pull claims out of air.

25% worse is silly good. Lol lol

Also bomb squigs are affected by DDD extra explodey squigs!

Is it bad I REALLY want to do Goff and blood axes together. Goff boys and leaders. Blood axe kommandos, bikes, and burnas. Oh god blood axe burnas will be so fething good. But that is literally the two clans with opposite fluff cries in ghaz

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:
I just don't play like a snail

Neither do i. Good luck on opponents watching my dice roll. Doesn't help much when rules are so slow that what used to be easy 2k in 2h became impossibie.

Slower rules isn't good thing. But hey somebody who thinks buff that gives you 25% less wounds than other makes things ridiculously good...lol. worse buff making things worse. Your credibility is pretty low with that.

Speaking of credibility, where is yours? All you do is shut people down through this thread and the ork tactics thread too.

You think giving buffs to boys is better than giving buffs to other units in the codex. If all you want to use is boys go ahead, many people don't want to just keep spamming greentide to remain semi competitive.

Try helping the community instead of being toxic and constantly bringing up knights every 5 seconds.

Orkz struggle vs vehicles of all shapes and sizes not just the boogeyman of the castellan.

Provide solutions to this problem that doesn't involve mob it with boys then your credibility will be alot better.

If you want to carry this on, PM and we can discuss the pros and cons of different strategies we can use against knights.

I've already expressed mine which is snakebite tank bustas deepstriking with da jump and tellyport, popping more dakka and monsterhunters which deals 9 unsaved wounds to a castellan on a 3++ so 27 damage before squigs and is cheaper than said knight

You provide buffs that are slow, i say i would prefer buff that isn't as fast, you claim it would be ridiculously broken good because it'" 25% worse than your buff. Lol. I look at math and logic. You just pull claims out of air.

25% worse is silly good. Lol lol

Lol lol lol your saying deepstriking tankbustas is slow lol lol? Pulling stuff out of thin air you are.

How many times do I have to state about snakebite tankbustas?

Try stop thinking about boys for a change your statistics don't really do much in a game where anything can happen.... not everything is in a vacuum.

And to be brutally honest, I don't want a +1 to wound coming from a cheap ass mek. A reroll is fine.

I have fun and I win games, I don't want to trash can my opponent with the next best GW cheese.

I've came up with a solution to vehicles that doesn't involve a wave of boys and is effective vs all types of vehicles

LOL.. I don't hang out around here often (usually only looking for rumors when something I'm interested in is pending). Are all new GW releases treated with this level of scorn or are there books that everyone is thrilled with?

Just curious if there was Eldar rage, if Ad Mech generals were incredulous at the point cost of one of their tech-whatzits, or this is just an Ork trait. I see many people bemoaning the fact that GW can't properly point cost their models so I'm assuming everyone is in the same boat..

 quindia wrote:
LOL.. I don't hang out around here often (usually only looking for rumors when something I'm interested in is pending). Are all new GW releases treated with this level of scorn or are there books that everyone is thrilled with?

Just curious if there was Eldar rage, if Ad Mech generals were incredulous at the point cost of one of their tech-whatzits, or this is just an Ork trait. I see many people bemoaning the fact that GW can't properly point cost their models so I'm assuming everyone is in the same boat..

Sadly it seems to be dakka's nature. I only tend to frequent when b and c is down plus dakka often gets rumours quicker than other places.

 quindia wrote:
LOL.. I don't hang out around here often (usually only looking for rumors when something I'm interested in is pending). Are all new GW releases treated with this level of scorn or are there books that everyone is thrilled with?

Just curious if there was Eldar rage, if Ad Mech generals were incredulous at the point cost of one of their tech-whatzits, or this is just an Ork trait. I see many people bemoaning the fact that GW can't properly point cost their models so I'm assuming everyone is in the same boat..

If books are obviously and massively OP and undercosted like Astra Militarum, Craftworlds, Dark Eldar and Imperial Knights, there tend to be (somewhat) fewer complaints.

Books that are actually reasonably balanced, the gnashing of teeth tends to be worse.

You're on an internet forums. A place specifically designed to express people opinions. If you don't like it then don't come on here or try post positive opinions rather bogging down the forums with the same copy pasted message resulting in my responding with the same copy pasted message.

Anyway... Who is hyped for death skullz today? What we expecting in the preview you think?

Stompa degrading at 75% where as other vehicles degrade at 50% makes it basically a throw away unit already. 920 points on top of that? Might as well just melt down the sprues. New Ork combo is basically take your money + stompa and throw them both into a trash bin.

 quindia wrote:
LOL.. I don't hang out around here often (usually only looking for rumors when something I'm interested in is pending). Are all new GW releases treated with this level of scorn or are there books that everyone is thrilled with?

Just curious if there was Eldar rage, if Ad Mech generals were incredulous at the point cost of one of their tech-whatzits, or this is just an Ork trait. I see many people bemoaning the fact that GW can't properly point cost their models so I'm assuming everyone is in the same boat..

No, there was plenty of disappointment when the new eldar webway portal was also "not even if it was free" level bad, there were complaints when it was revealed Dark Eldar hqs would still be footslogging-only, there were complaints when Space Wolves needed day-1 errata, complaints when wraithknights were still unusably bad.

It is possible for someone to have a negative opinion on one fact while still having a positive opinion on the release as a whole. If you look on previous pages, you'll see plenty of positive reactions to positive reveals.

 quindia wrote:
LOL.. I don't hang out around here often (usually only looking for rumors when something I'm interested in is pending). Are all new GW releases treated with this level of scorn or are there books that everyone is thrilled with?

Just curious if there was Eldar rage, if Ad Mech generals were incredulous at the point cost of one of their tech-whatzits, or this is just an Ork trait. I see many people bemoaning the fact that GW can't properly point cost their models so I'm assuming everyone is in the same boat..

Its called critical thinking as each book is a collection of separate rules. If someone is thrilled OR has scorn for everything in a given book then they aren't using their brain very hard or they don't understand the game at all.

 lolman1c wrote:
Okay... welll... erm... just did a practice game with the new rules (new weapons, price and dakkadakka) for the stompa vs 2 Shadowswords.

Let's go through this mess....

Stompa: 920 points 40 wounds

vs

2 Shadowswords: 808 points 52 wounds

Turn 1: (stompa goes first)

1 damage from super gat
7 damage from deffkannon

total, 8 damage to 1 Shadow

Shadowsword turn 1:

4 damage from heavy bolters

73 wounds from the two Volcano Cannons...

-_-

We played another game when the stompa was charge range... He got 1 shadowsword down to about 10 wounds but then they both just pulled back and did 52 wounds to him.

This didn't happen. Mathematics doesn't exist. Play testing doesn't work. Just guess the stats and the points values and you'll be okay.

Wellllllll! Luckily for us we have a game from warhammer themselves tonight!

ORKS VS KNIGHTS!!!




this should be fun to watch.... XD

 lolman1c wrote:
Wellllllll! Luckily for us we have a game from warhammer themselves tonight!

ORKS VS KNIGHTS!!!

Spoiler:

this should be fun to watch.... XD

This seems like a bad way to showcase the new Orks.

That'll be cute.

At least they're reading the thread. Hi, GW.

Live, right? That game should be so embarassing for GW that there's no way they would publish it if it were pre-recorded.

We will see, a bit of me hopes it's all good (and they give the ork player weighted dice). This for me will tell me what the new codex really is.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Live, right? That game should be so embarassing for GW that there's no way they would publish it if it were pre-recorded.

We'll be able to see the realization steadily dawn in real time!

Thats pretty cool. My guess is that theyre going to be making a list primarily with new units/speed freeks. Curious to how it will turn out. My gut says that knights would stomp a list like that but GW wouldnt want to show off their new codex/models getting steamrolled either.

Is there even a way to intentionally or unintentionally build a Knight list so badly that this would be a fair matchup?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Live, right? That game should be so embarassing for GW that there's no way they would publish it if it were pre-recorded.

You mean embarrassing for the knight player right??


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Is there even a way to intentionally or unintentionally build a Knight list so badly that this would be a fair matchup?

All melee knights?

The melee knights (gallants) are monsters. I'd say maybe a valiant and crusaders with the rapid fire battle cannon & thermal cannon loadouts. Those aren't bad, just not as points efficient. And the autocannon carapace weapons since they are easily the least worth it IMO.

Maybe the preceptor if the don't bring armigers for him to buff.

But building a poor knight list is pretty difficult, they could just be playing the stratagems in a dumb manner to compensate. I doubt we'll see house raven

Just because Knights will be used, doesn't mean the person USING Knights understands how to play the game.

Also, its worth noting that while the battle does start at 6:15 BST, there is stuff leading up to that as well

Orks Lore: 4-5 BST

Mastering Codex Orks: 5-6 BST

 Billagio wrote:
Also, its worth noting that while the battle does start at 6:15 BST, there is stuff leading up to that as well

Orks Lore: 4-5 BST

Mastering Codex Orks: 5-6 BST

Yes, they might give out some info so i expect you to all be watching!

Yeah i think pure knights are actually going to struggle against orks, especially with all the gapclosing they've given the orks in the new codex. Play it smart and any Armigers/helverins are going to be swamped and not shooting real quick, and any Wardens/gatling crusaders are going to be taken out ASAP.

It's screened knights orks will really struggle against. Pure knights will have a puny CP pool, and be much, much easier to close against. After just 1 or 2 goes down, the orks will be pretty much in good shape.

I shall be refreshing this thread with great interest. I call upon you, my British comrades who will be getting out of work when I'm just starting 1PM!

Deathskulls up

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/10/26/26th-oct-clan-fokus-deathskullsgw-homepage-post-2/

Some fun stuff in there. The extra stikkbombs strat is going to be crazy on tankbustas

 Billagio wrote:
Deathskulls up

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/10/26/26th-oct-clan-fokus-deathskullsgw-homepage-post-2/

“Dis is Ours! Zogg Off!” sounds like objective secure, but they have it for all infantry. Plus they get 1 hit, 1 wound and 1 damage reroll per unit in the shooting and fight phase. AND a 6++ save. Deathskulls look pretty tempting to me

Warphead strat, 1 CP to upgrade a Wierdboy and they know and can cast an extra power per turn

Edit: from the Stream right now

Well, I'm happy I painted my orks blue. Invulns are always welcome, but those rerolls are also quite nice, especially for fighty warbosses. Hope they give lootas 3shots up from D3.

Bowie wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
Deathskulls up

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/10/26/26th-oct-clan-fokus-deathskullsgw-homepage-post-2/

“Dis is Ours! Zogg Off!” sounds like objective secure, but they have it for all infantry. Plus they get 1 hit, 1 wound and 1 damage reroll per unit in the shooting and fight phase. AND a 6++ save. Deathskulls look pretty tempting to me

Yea obsec on all infantry is interesting. The kultur does look strong.

 Malkyr wrote:
Warphead strat, 1 CP to upgrade a Wierdboy and they know and can cast an extra power per turn

Edit: from the Stream right now

Top man, keep the new stuff coming!

I was playing this strat totally wrong with my buddies....

I didn't realize it was

1 hit roll
and
1 to wound roll
and
1 damage roll

PER unit, Per shooting and Per fighting.

That's REALLY NICE.

 greggles wrote:
I was playing this strat totally wrong with my buddies....

I didn't realize it was

1 hit roll
and
1 to wound roll
and
1 damage roll

PER unit, Per shooting and Per fighting.

That's REALLY NICE.

It's really good. That is a TON of re-rolls each turn. Considering that a re-roll usually costs a CP, it's a good value.

 greggles wrote:
I was playing this strat totally wrong with my buddies....

I didn't realize it was

1 hit roll
and
1 to wound roll
and
1 damage roll

PER unit, Per shooting and Per fighting.

That's REALLY NICE.

Yeah, it's the salamanders trait but better. And they get an invuln. And obsec on all infantry. That's pretty darn good

So flipping excited that I started paintin the boyz blue!

Wow, that's a pretty great stratagem too. I think that and the obsec probably moves the Deff Skullz up into tier 1 along with the Evil Sunz and Blood Axes.

Loot It! also looks awesome, especially because Mek Gunz are vehicles, AND units in transports get out before the vehicle is "destroyed" so you could pop out a unit of trukk boyz and instantly give them a 5+ save.

Which, ironically, means we have a 1cp way of getting 'ard boyz on the board if they're in a trukk. Or, a way to spend 3cp if we really REALLY want 4+ boyz.

Again a mention of the Mob Up stratagem. Combining units into a huge green tide again?

There will be several types of Battlewagons in the codex. More details in the later codex discussion (this is mainly just fluff discussion).

They also confirmed that Freebootaz is a choice of clan kultur for the army though I think that was pretty known already.

Snagged a new angle shot of the Squigbuggy. That's a large crew!

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Snagged a new angle shot of the Squigbuggy. That's a large crew!

It's unfortunate that the Squigbuggy is my favorite new model with my least favorite rules. Sigh.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Is there even a way to intentionally or unintentionally build a Knight list so badly that this would be a fair matchup?

I think you're hilariously underestimating this book.

 Malkyr wrote:
There will be several types of Battlewagons in the codex. More details in the later codex discussion (this is mainly just fluff discussion).

My money is on the two distinct kits in the GW online store:

- Battlewagon with Deffrolla
- Battlewagon without Deffrolla

 hordrak wrote:
Well, I'm happy I painted my orks blue. Invulns are always welcome, but those rerolls are also quite nice, especially for fighty warbosses. Hope they give lootas 3shots up from D3.

Well, that might be a bit much depending on points.

Hmm. Pretty impressed, I've always learned towards Death Skulls for my army theme these last few years.

However, I still think Bad Moons might be better on Lootaz.

Wonder if “Dis is Ours! Zogg Off!” will just join Objective Secured and Defenders of Humanity or if it will trump them? (now wouldn't that be fun)

Obsec....for everything???

WAAAGH!

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Wonder if “Dis is Ours! Zogg Off!” will just join Objective Secured and Defenders of Humanity or if it will trump them? (now wouldn't that be fun)

Theyre the same ability... No codex has an ability called "objective secured", they just call it something different.

Flash Gitz will not get any Clan Kultur rules other then Freebootaz, but you can include them in other detachments without losing your Clan rules (Like the Astra Militarum or Dark Eldar books)

So Deathskulls are the new winner for the heavy guns detachment? Rerolling one hit, wound, and damage per phase per unit works out much better on all those individual KMKs, gets you the reroll wounds and ten tankbusta bombs, and isn't too shabby on anything else with a big gun (or powerful melee attacks, really). The 6++ is just icing.

They mentioned Flash Gitz wont benefit from other klan rules, but it doesnt prevent you from getting the benefits on your other units if you have flash gitz in a detachment


EDIT: Whoops this was already mentioned by Malkyr, ill just let him report everything

Death Skulls might have the better Nobz and Mega Nobz.

the_scotsman wrote:
Wow, that's a pretty great stratagem too. I think that and the obsec probably moves the Deff Skullz up into tier 1 along with the Evil Sunz and Blood Axes.

Loot It! also looks awesome, especially because Mek Gunz are vehicles, AND units in transports get out before the vehicle is "destroyed" so you could pop out a unit of trukk boyz and instantly give them a 5+ save.

Which, ironically, means we have a 1cp way of getting 'ard boyz on the board if they're in a trukk. Or, a way to spend 3cp if we really REALLY want 4+ boyz.

3+ Ard Boy Blood Axes...crazy

So, MSU Death Skull Lootaz or big mob Bad Moon lootaz? Or Free Bootaz Lootaz?

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Death Skulls might have the better Nobz and Mega Nobz.

Maybe. If youre jumping/teleporting meganobz I think Evil Suns would still be better

 Billagio wrote:


EDIT: Whoops this was already mentioned by Malkyr, ill just let him report everything

Feel free to carry on, I wont be able to stay for most of the Codex discussion anyway so I'd appreciate someone recording what I miss!

I guess if you're playing with very serious WYSIWYG types when you use the wrecker stratagem you should also give any vehicles you destroy a quick spray with some blue paint...….

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
So, MSU Death Skull Lootaz or big mob Bad Moon lootaz? Or Free Bootaz Lootaz?

Bad Moon i'm certain - the 5+ DDD strat, plus reroll 1s will produce way more pain than the single reroll. Deathskullz for heavy hitting weapons.

does the loot it thing work for the transport the unit was in?

e.g. mega nobz in a truk you kill the truk an they jump out, whack on the stat they have now 1+ save (obv 1 always fails but good vs mods).

 Latro_ wrote:
does the loot it thing work for the transport the unit was in?

e.g. mega nobz in a truk you kill the truk an they jump out, whack on the stat they have now 1+ save (obv 1 always fails but good vs mods).

It does not specify enemy vehicles, so it would seem that you can totally loot your own vehicles.
Which makes sense, actually. Why wouldn't the Orks strip down their vehicles after it gets destroyed? I could totally see them doing that.

Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

 bullyboy wrote:
Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

The sequence of events is

1) unit explodes, resolve mortals if applicable.

2) unit gets out within 3", rolls for 1s to see if models die.

3) transport is 'destroyed' and removed from play.

So yeah, it works on the transport you were riding in.

 bullyboy wrote:
Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

So if the unit is embarked when it's destroyed, can they loot their own transport?

So... the Ork Codex is actually coming out in NOVEMBER and not ORKTOBER? Speed Freaks is coming out just four days before November? What marketing genus at GW came up with that? LOL Looks like Orktober was a big Orkfailure.

Happy for the Ork players to finally get a proper Codex for 8th. The new buggies are fantastic and very Mad Max. The stratagems dropped so far seem very Orky, but far too random for my tastes. Other people love it though, and it's very much in the flavor of what GW presents the Orks as.

 TedNugent wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

So if the unit is embarked when it's destroyed, can they loot their own transport?

Yes. Read the "transports' block in the rules. You get out before the vehicle is destroyed.

the_scotsman wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

The sequence of events is

1) unit explodes, resolve mortals if applicable.

2) unit gets out within 3", rolls for 1s to see if models die.

3) transport is 'destroyed' and removed from play.

So yeah, it works on the transport you were riding in.

Alternatively, you could have 30 blood axes boys follow around something fragile, like a lone killa kan.
Killa kan gets destroyed, you activate Loot it. You now have 30 boys with 4+ armor saves. If they are 'ard boyz they now have 3+ saves.
For 3 CP you can field 30 3+ saves for 180 points. I understand now why the 'ard boy strat is 2CP.

 Tamwulf wrote:
So... the Ork Codex is actually coming out in NOVEMBER and not ORKTOBER? Speed Freaks is coming out just four days before November? What marketing genus at GW came up with that? LOL Looks like Orktober was a big Orkfailure.

Ok, that's it. Cancel the codex. Pack it in guys. GW is done.

i guess it comes down to when it counts as 'destroyed' its still there on the table when they get out of it and before its removed

the_scotsman wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
Doubt it, unit is not on table to be within 3" of transport when destroyed.

The sequence of events is

1) unit explodes, resolve mortals if applicable.

2) unit gets out within 3", rolls for 1s to see if models die.

3) transport is 'destroyed' and removed from play.

So yeah, it works on the transport you were riding in.

I'd tend to agree with The_Scotsman... But it's one of the classic RAW/RAI interpretations that'll probably need a GW FAQ clarification. Else people could argue around in circles for days. It would make sense that it was intended to buff trukk boys. Because they are so useless pre-Codex.

Picking a clan is going to be damn hard.

I might have to flip a coin after doing best of three - with reflips.

"So he [Wazdakka] is not in the current Ork Codex because there is no model for him"

Straight from GW's mouth, in case anyone still doubted the "no model, no rules" policy.

as i said a few pages back multiple detachments focused on different clans is gonna be the standard IMO.

 Tamwulf wrote:
So... the Ork Codex is actually coming out in NOVEMBER and not ORKTOBER? Speed Freaks is coming out just four days before November? What marketing genus at GW came up with that? LOL Looks like Orktober was a big Orkfailure.

The genius who realised that if all the new stuff was released any earlier, they'd have no new content to post on the community site through the rest of the month.

 lolman1c wrote:
You're on an internet forums. A place specifically designed to express people opinions. If you don't like it then don't come on here or try post positive opinions rather bogging down the forums with the same copy pasted message resulting in my responding with the same copy pasted message.

I love the internet. There was nothing copy and paste in my post, or did you miss the part about I don’t frequent the forum? I was reading posts about how bad everything seems, mixed with posts about how this was typical of GW. That made me think all the books must be unbalanced and was more generally curious if ANY were. I don’t think I commented on the vaidity of anyone’s opinions. This is just a reminder of why I don’t frequent the forums. If you and I were standing in a shop having the same discussion, I imagine we’d have a pleasant exchange.

Man, this makes me regret the fact that the buggies aren't dual-kits with shared bitz. I would totally have bought a Trukk, made the second buggy out of the trukk skeleton, and modeled ten boyz all holding bits of the trukk to represent my post-Loot It trukk boyz.

Re-use the heads from the trukk sprues to have the gunner just holding the Big Shoota still in the trukk mount, have the driver head on an ork boy holding a steering wheel on a stick as his choppa, one boy holding the door as a shield...

 Kirasu wrote:
Just because Knights will be used, doesn't mean the person USING Knights understands how to play the game.

True. This also applies to the ork player.

We might learn some stuff about the release, but I doubt we'll learn a lot about tactics. I'll still be watching

Mandragola wrote:

 Kirasu wrote:
Just because Knights will be used, doesn't mean the person USING Knights understands how to play the game.

True. This also applies to the ork player.

We might learn some stuff about the release, but I doubt we'll learn a lot about tactics. I'll still be watching

I still remember I watched a preview game for the 8th ed Tsons codex and one of the players had a predator with a twin las turret, 2 heavy bolters and a combi-melta.

That was an exciting moment for me.

That's a really great point that it can be used by the units inside a transport, after the transport blows up - if it sticks and actually does work this way, well; my love for the strategem just went up.

Shame it's a 5+ for 2cp, but I guess it's something - especially if it works with the Blood Axe's cover.

Also @CthululsSpy; they could just not attack that lone Killa Kan, as in reality, it's not likely to do too much - but it's an interesting concept.

As far as the new Deathskulls preview - color me hyped. It seems like they've got winning strategems, and that re-roll trait - so much better than I ever could have hoped for. Not so great for large squads; but I'll gladly take it on KMK/Cannon units.

I'm curious how the 3cp Snakebite stratagem will work out versus the 2cp Wreckers; I guess it will come out to army composition and metagame; and what you want to teleport in - depending how you can build a list, but you may be able to have some versatility every game.

Orks will need a lot of CP it seems - looks like grots are back on the menu, Boyz.

 TedNugent wrote:
Picking a clan is going to be damn hard.

I might have to flip a coin after doing best of three - with reflips.

This. How lucky are we to have so many clans that seem viable?

With all the stratagems and options, it's going to take a while to fully digest the ork book.

With what we've heard so far, I believe we are at least mid-tier, even if there are some misses (what book doesn't have these?)

If GW does something against soup with CA, but leaves Ork Soup as-is, I'm liking our chances.

Points will tell all.

The guy talking about the Codex is saying he focuses a lot on tournaments and the competitive scene. Thinks the codex is going to be really competitive and disrupt the IK/Imperial Soup meta

fe40k wrote:
That's a really great point that it can be used by the units inside a transport, after the transport blows up - if it sticks and actually does work this way, well; my love for the strategem just went up.

Shame it's a 5+ for 2cp, but I guess it's something - especially if it works with the Blood Axe's cover.

Also @CthululsSpy; they could just not attack that lone Killa Kan, as in reality, it's not likely to do too much - but it's an interesting concept.

As far as the new Deathskulls preview - color me hyped. It seems like they've got winning strategems, and that re-roll trait - so much better than I ever could have hoped for. Not so great for large squads; but I'll gladly take it on KMK/Cannon units.

I'm curious how the 3cp Snakebite stratagem will work out versus the 2cp Wreckers; I guess it will come out to army composition and metagame; and what you want to teleport in - depending how you can build a list, but you may be able to have some versatility every game.

Orks will need a lot of CP it seems - looks like grots are back on the menu, Boyz.

Good thing I have 120 of those.

Also, Loot it! is 1CP, and it works on any infantry unit, not just boyz.

So, you know, 5+ boyz, or 3+ nobz, or 1+ Meganobz... With what we know about nobz (them getting a double-choppa option specifically, and this stratagem) i'm not seeing how they can be that underpowered. 10 nobz with double choppa and 3+ armor save throwing out 50 S4 attacks is pretty good.

 Trimarius wrote:
So Deathskulls are the new winner for the heavy guns detachment? Rerolling one hit, wound, and damage per phase per unit works out much better on all those individual KMKs, gets you the reroll wounds and ten tankbusta bombs, and isn't too shabby on anything else with a big gun (or powerful melee attacks, really). The 6++ is just icing.

To be fair that grenade strategem didn't say Deathskullz strategem so it will be available to all kulturs.

Wartike Confirmed 120 points all wargear included. Likely can get first turn charge all the time. Quoted stats are basically what was leaked



Automatically Appended Next Post:
ere we go confirmed to be either dice, not just both


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Confirmed you dont need to rebase your models to 32mm. 25mm is still supported

They were just mentioning that from a competitive standpoint, his plan is to get into melee; the shooting is just a bonus.

I hope a decent (albeit if not the most competitive) list can be made from shooting units.

One battlewagon good at movement and advancing, BW with lots of guns (gunwagon) hitting on 4s?, Bonebreaker BW with a deffrolla. I think he mentioned this one also give them extra WS?

Sorry he was talking super fast

3 Battlewagons:

- basic
- gunwagon (BS4+)
- bonebreaka (deffrolla)

Sounds like they mostly just split the unit entry, maybe just to get more granular Power Levels.

So...what if you have a battlewagon with the rolla and killkannon? Because that's what my wagon has.

KMF is 9" apparently, stratagem to increase it to 18", affects units, 5++ invul.

Mentioned KFF is every unit within 6 inches gets the save, rather than every model.

Stompa extends range to KFF range to 18".

KFF: Every unit in 9" !!! (he corrected himself)

Strategem can boost it to 18"

Ninja'd

 lord_blackfang wrote:
3 Battlewagons:

- basic
- gunwagon (BS4+)
- bonebreaka (deffrolla)

Sounds like they mostly just split the unit entry, maybe just to get more granular Power Levels.

Also maybe to get around the rule of three for people who want to play Blitz Brigade style armies?

If basic is a Dedicated Transport that would make me extra-happy.

An outrider detachment called the boosta blasta led by a mega armoured big mek with kff for 362 points. Are there multiple KBBs in there? 3KBB plus him for 362
They are way less than 120!

EDIT: 100 points each

Kustom Boosta Blasta 100 points, Weirdboy still 62

KBB 100 pts!

Well the interesting thing about the loot it strategem. For 1 CP that unit gets the +1 SV. Now say you had already upgraded the unit to ardboys for 2 CP. Turn 1, your opponent now has a choice.

They have to focus the 5+ SV ork boys, 4+ with the bloodaxe kultur unless they have AP modifiers or ignore cover.

Or they can focus your vehicles who are flanking them or are out in front. If they focus the vehicle and kill it. Then you are going to upgrade your boys. If they don't then the vehicle is going to book it straight down the middle of the table.

On to turn 2, realistically you will have more than 1 vehicle so which one does your opponent focus on now. killing off the 3+ save boys, who could have had a painboy nearby from the beginning or the next vehicles approaching. If they focus a vehicle you pop the strategem on another unit nearby.

Whether this will truely work or not, idk. But forcing your opponent into bad decisions is always makes for an exciting game.

Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

Ooooh this stuff looks so hot.

Loving this stream.

E - Boyz at 7ppm......

The 1cp stikkbomb strat will make trukkboyz scary again. 60 shots from 10 boyz isn't bad at all, especially bad moons.

It will go well with the blood axe trait also--fall back the choppa boyz and stikkbomb them. Then charge again. 23 quick st3 hits from 10 guys! waaaaay better than guardsmen.

Remembering all of this crap is what is going to be hard.

The guy seems pretty dialed in as well. (And maybe on speed haha)

painboy is now 52pts base..... 65pts in total

Warbikes 23 points each

3 warbikes for 69 points. Meaning 23 ppm, down 4ppm

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

hes 112pts, 77 base, 13 for klaw, 2 for kustom shoota and 20 for kff

Boosta-blasta in his list is 100 points! Unless im misreading - anyone want to confirm?

Scrapjet 99 pts

 deffrekka wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

hes 112pts, 77 base, 13 for klaw, 2 for kustom shoota and 20 for kff

Oh yeah my bad I was looking at base cost

Warbikes at 23 are still garbage unless they've gained something..

Buggies besides the Squigbuggy are 100 points or cheaper (but was just going off the top of his head)

He also said ALL Buggies are BS4 (or 3 for SJD) for ALL shots. I wonder if he's made a mistake?

Mh i think the French Wargame Studio seriously mispelled the name of the buggy to mistake 3 times in a row lol.


All those things looks so promising!

Blood axe mega nobz in battlewagon exploding? Use the CP and get +0 armor save! xD

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Warbikes at 23 are still garbage unless they've gained something..

Traits and wartrikes?

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
He also said ALL Buggies are BS4 (or 3 for SJD) for ALL shots. I wonder if he's made a mistake?

Noticed that too. They are not really modeled as such but that would make the points more palatable no doubt

WD preview has a bunch of unit power levels:



MANz are 2PL each, 'nauts are now 15PL

Did he say why he's taking squads of Boyz in 20's, instead of 30's?

Seems like a number that you'd run with Battlewagons - but he doesn't have any?

I had to step away for a moment - perhaps I missed something in the list.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Warbikes at 23 are still garbage unless they've gained something..

Traits and wartrikes?

Sorry what I meant was something other than traits (that every other army got) and Wartrikes that cost 120ppm....

That's nowhere near enough. They are far too expensive.

On the subject of Wartrikes, they're vehicles so can be healed by Meks/Big Meks

so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

Interesting, Gorkanauts went down to 15PL from 19. Wonder if there is a point reduction in there too. Also 10 MANZ would be 20PL as well which means they went down too (and can use teleport). 3PL trukks

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

where are you getting this from?

mhalko1 wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

where are you getting this from?

Sorry I was looking at base cost not with wargear. Someone corrected me

Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Regarding nob bikers:
"They're probably not as awesome as you want them to be"

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Did he say they were 2 wounds or was he looking at nob bikers?

Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

 Billagio wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Did he say they were 2 wounds or was he looking at nob bikers?

Normal bikers are 2wounds.

He was checking if they had 2 DakkaGuns (which they did, "as expected").

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

Stream confirmed jumping out and taking advantage of the strat before the trukk is destroyed.

Ha bikes are already 2 wounds...I always assumed they were 1 wound. Shows how much Ive used them

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

The reason why Blood axes were mentioned is because they are (supposedly) always in cover.
So that means Blood axe boyz effectively have 5+ saves.
With 'ard boyz that becomes 4+ saves.
With Loot it it becomes 3+ saves.

Blood axe nobz would be 2+ saves, and meganobz become 0+ (only for the purposes of modifiers, obviously)

Non-Blood axe units would be capped at 4+ saves.

"Well, in hyper competitive you won't see Stompas"
"40w, 3+ armor save"
"You're shooting like 18 shots a turn"
"Stompas are WAYYY better, but you have to remember, Orks are better"
"Orks always hitting on 6's, make the Stompa BadMoonz to reroll 1s"
"Blood Axe Stompa, 2+"
"Two meks inside, one hops out each round and heals it before it runs off"

I mean, for 940 points - I'm still not sold.

Stop pulling a Reece and hyping up a bad unit; I get you're a mouthpiece, but you're representing the only really informed individual we have at the moment; as you have the codex in hand.

I'm surprised Painboyz went up in price. Maybe there's a strat or change to Dok Toolz that make them more useful? I'm pretty sure the FNP bubble is still only 6+, so unless they changed how it works, I don't know why you wouldn't just take a Big Mek in most cases besides healing Weirdboy duty.

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Regarding nob bikers:
"They're probably not as awesome as you want them to be"

I lol'd.

Then facepalmed.

He was claiming Bikes are good because they had 2 wounds "not like previous editions".

23 point bikes is really, really poor. Not surprising though. At least Buggies seem OK.

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Couldn't agree more.

I was going to say thank God for obsec all on deffskulls with boys going up in price, until I saw the KFF reading. Yeah, no.

KFF is mandatory with those rules.

Esp with points increases.

Wait, Klaws are 13 points?

What's the cost on a Powerfist?

fe40k wrote:
Wait, Klaws are 13 points?

What's the cost on a Powerfist?

The same IRRC.

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

Orks get a stratagem that can resurrect a dead squad.
Necrons, an army with Resurrection as a main theme, don't.
Dammit GW

Imho painboy was just increased to make snakebites more appealing, because they have little else and there's no other reason for the really frankly mediocre painboy to go up in price.

As a force multiplier, KFF will again be king.

Flash gitz are 4+ BS now.
The captain hits on a 3+ because of squig.

 TedNugent wrote:
Imho painboy was just increased to make snakebites more appealing, because they have little else and there's no other reason for the really frankly mediocre painboy to go up in price.

As a force multiplier, KFF will again be king.

That's a real bummer if that's the case. Could at least have made Painboyz made units that have a FNP equivalent just re-roll failed rolls of 1, instead of being useless for them. Hell, even +1 to the FNP save would make Snakebitez a real consideration against the other Klanz.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

That's some fantasy wish list you've come up with, got any references?

 TedNugent wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

That's some fantasy wish list you've come up with, got any references?

Uhh...everything on the stream...

 Daedalus81 wrote:
23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

And worse BS (on a shooty unit). 4+ save is 16% worse than 3+ save. 2pts is not 16% pts difference. And I don't see armies of CSM bikes at tournaments, in fact, I never see any CSM bikes at tournaments.... sooo probably not the best comparison (particularly when they're better).

Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

Flasbooterz kultur confirmed as per the original rumour
(+1 to hit for subsequent units when an enemy is destroyed)

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

I'm a necron player, and we pay a premium for a special rule that can cancelled out pretty easily.
Its not great.

How the hell has the painboy gone up in points!!!!!! and by 12!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously!

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

Also, Snakebites traditionally had lots of painboyz (for things like boarboyz and cyboars). It's weird for painboys to be useless for them.

Did they say if the "resurrect" stratagem brings the squad back as they were so to speak? So if a unit of skarboyz are brought back, are they skarboyz or normal boyz? Same with if they had the loot it stratagem put on them? Do they still get to keep their improvements?

Also from the looks of it I was totally correct and the big mek with kff is also now gone so that's more points we have to tack on....

 Grimskul wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Wait, Klaws are 13 points?

What's the cost on a Powerfist?

The same IRRC.

Powerfists are 12pts if my memory is correct

Is painboy confirmed to be 6+++? or did he go to 5?

Wazbombblasta jet is 160points... seriously, how can you justify this?

Both fists and klaws were originally 25pts but because the lack of insta-sporking happened NOBODY wanted them anymore at that price. Codex and CA dropped it to 12/13 respectively, presumably orks cost 1pt more because imperial bia- er i mean S10/12 depending on who has it.

Also i seriously dont see why the painboy went up. I legitimately only used the idiot because on 90+ boyz why WOULDNT you? with that many bodies hes going to get some payback, but still not insanely good. I'd just much rather have him than half a boy unit.

 lolman1c wrote:
Wazbombblasta jet is 160points... seriously, how can you justify this?

Maybe the rules are massively improved? We don't know anything about it yet..

Do we roll to see if the Trukk explodes before we loot it or after?

Trukk Boys may be much more viable if their total cost dropped and with that Stratagem synergy.

Or Trukk Nobz. A 3+ save would be tasty. Although we've probably lost the ammo runt shenanigans.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Both fists and klaws were originally 25pts but because the lack of insta-sporking happened NOBODY wanted them anymore at that price. Codex and CA dropped it to 12/13 respectively, presumably orks cost 1pt more because imperial bia- er i mean S10/12 depending on who has it.

Also i seriously dont see why the painboy went up. I legitimately only used the idiot because on 90+ boyz why WOULDNT you? with that many bodies hes going to get some payback, but still not insanely good. I'd just much rather have him than half a boy unit.

Lol I also used him just so I didn't have to take more Boyz. There's no reason I can think that he's took a price increase.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

And worse BS (on a shooty unit). 4+ save is 16% worse than 3+ save. 2pts is not 16% pts difference. And I don't see armies of CSM bikes at tournaments, in fact, I never see any CSM bikes at tournaments.... sooo probably not the best comparison (particularly when they're better).

I don't agree. You don't see CSM bikes at tournaments, because they don't have what Orks now have.

6 shots with DDD results in 2.3 hits.
At long range it's 1.3 hits for CSM or 2.6 within 12".

Blood Axes bikes would be an equivalent save if you wanted.
Or you can give them a 5++ or 6++.
Or you can make the M16 +1A +1C
Or FNP which is great on W2 models
Or give them exploding melee attacks.
And the trait (Renegades) CSM could use to advance and charge...is covered by the trike.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

I'm a necron player, and we pay a premium for a special rule that can cancelled out pretty easily.
Its not great.

GW is tableflipping the 7e meta. Tau, Necrons and Demons and marines are now down.

We just need the pointy ears to get theirs and all will be well.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

I'm a necron player, and we pay a premium for a special rule that can cancelled out pretty easily.
Its not great.

I understand. as the 2 armies I play are orks and necrons. I get double shafted in this situation. Hopefully not on the orks side anymore.

 JimOnMars wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

I'm a necron player, and we pay a premium for a special rule that can cancelled out pretty easily.
Its not great.

GW is tableflipping the 7e meta. Tau, Necrons and Demons and marines are now down.

We just need the pointy ears to get theirs and all will be well.

Swear someone high up in GW is a fanatical eldar player, they have been pretty unstoppable at tournaments since 7th edition

Sorry, i thought Wazbomb Blasta jet was the new ork vechile... sorry for that.

fe40k wrote:
They were just mentioning that from a competitive standpoint, his plan is to get into melee; the shooting is just a bonus.

I hope a decent (albeit if not the most competitive) list can be made from shooting units.

Your joking right? You can take 9 shock jump buggies for under 1K and make them def skulls. They hit on a 3 with a free reroll to hit, wound and damage roll EACH. This book is not difficult to power game at all from the leaked cultures and strats alone.

All that crying over imaginary spilled milk with boys being 7ppm, and now what the few were telling you, wait and see, turns out to be true and worse. Turns out you can easily start the game with a full battalion of blood axes with 4+ saves and maxed defskull buggies between them form an outrider, oh whats that? They will shoot the buggies? Right, so you not only have a 6++ but when it does finally go down, without degrading, for only 1cp one of those bricks of 30 blood ax boys becomes 3+ save...

This books traits are easily the most broken the game has seen. Some of these klans are getting 2-3 other factions traits all rolled into one and some even better.

mhalko1 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"

I'm a necron player, and we pay a premium for a special rule that can cancelled out pretty easily.
Its not great.

I understand. as the 2 armies I play are orks and necrons. I get double shafted in this situation

I also play Orks, though I think they might be in a better place overall than necrons.
Better traits, more options, not as over priced.

nope thats the last flyer they gave us.
which i dont even know how good it was before, since i stopped playing when it popped up and never proxied one of my dakkajets as it in 8th.

 lolman1c wrote:
Sorry, i thought Wazbomb Blasta jet was the new ork vechile... sorry for that.

Haha, easy mistake to make I guess.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
3 Battlewagons:

- basic
- gunwagon (BS4+)
- bonebreaka (deffrolla)

Sounds like they mostly just split the unit entry, maybe just to get more granular Power Levels.

Or to break the rule of 3 again.

 Red Corsair wrote:

fe40k wrote:
They were just mentioning that from a competitive standpoint, his plan is to get into melee; the shooting is just a bonus.

I hope a decent (albeit if not the most competitive) list can be made from shooting units.

Your joking right? You can take 9 shock jump buggies for under 1K and make them def skulls. They hit on a 3 with a free reroll to hit, wound and damage roll EACH. This book is not difficult to power game at all from the leaked cultures and strats alone.

All that crying over imaginary spilled milk with boys being 7ppm, and now what the few were telling you, wait and see, turns out to be true and worse. Turns out you can easily start the game with a full battalion of blood axes with 4+ saves and maxed defskull buggies between them form an outrider, oh whats that? They will shoot the buggies? Right, so you not only have a 6++ but when it does finally go down, without degrading, for only 1cp one of those bricks of 30 blood ax boys becomes 3+ save...

This books traits are easily the most broken the game has seen. Some of these klans are getting 2-3 other factions traits all rolled into one and some even better.

In order to get those 4+ saves you need to burn 2Cp though, unless boyz now have 5+ saves base. Still bloody good though.