So, I got my pretty little butt kicked yesterday by a 'cron army. A 1k point game, I was experimenting with Repentia, so the loss wasn't entirely unexpected... even so, I've come to conclude that our standard meltagun/exorcist tactics just aren't cutting it.
Lychguard (and presumably wraiths) are just too resilient against high-AP fire with their 3++/4+RP. The Repentia managed to kill two of them, but nothing else even scratched the paint.
So... at 1000 points, an anti-Necron tailored list. Thoughts?
The Retributors and Battle Sisters form a firing line, aiming to take down enemy scorers. The Battle Conclave with two Priests intercept and tarpit anything stupidly resilient like Lychguard, while the Dominions lurk until the enemy heavy armour shows up. Their only job is to take out a Monolith or any Barges that show up, so they get to play hide and seek in the toughest metal box I can find, while the Conclave's repressor acts as bait for enemy anti-armour weapons.
Hm. Actually, the two aren't incompatible... if I drop the meltagun to a flamer and the Conclave to 6 Arco-flagellants, I can get a 20-strong Sisters blob in;
Furyou Miko wrote: Hm. Actually, the two aren't incompatible... if I drop the meltagun to a flamer and the Conclave to 6 Arco-flagellants, I can get a 20-strong Sisters blob in;
I agree with the choices, i just think the list could be less "tailored" and still work... But i have not faced the new Necrons so take the comment lightly.
I'd swap out one of the Rets with Exo and save some point on the Acro-Flagellants. Not sure what to get with the spare points, Bastion for the Rets? Or transport for the BSS cut down to 5-girls (keeping the Specials).
Then it's pretty much and all-comers list with a slight focus on Necrons
It actually isn't that tailored. It's pretty solid for 1k against most opponents.
Bastion for the rets would be awesome. I'd easily drop the flagg and a couple BSS from the smaller squad for it.
^^; I can't take a bastion, carrying the thing is just not practicable.
As for how tailored it is... that's just a side effect of it being a Sisters list, I think. ^^; It is tailored. There's just... not much tailoring you can actually do, I guess?
Still, Flaggies not a fan choice? I was thinking in terms of volume of S5 attacks so that maybe there's a chance of wearing the tarpit down a little.
I went with massed retributors rather than an Exorcist because you can't guarantee more than 1 or 2 rockets from the Exo and even 6 shots at S8 is only half the potential armour saves as the Retributors can put down. With the Lychguard outright ignoring 11/12 of all incoming fire...
pretre wrote: I constructed my Bastion in two halves and magnetized it for exactly that reason.
Mine also splits from the base - > walls and the Battlements can be removed =)
Also for ease of carry.
As for the Flagg, i'd say they could do quite well (like repentia -> if they get in before being mowed down) but it's always the "CC models in a Shooty army" syndrome. They will be a target.
I completely agree on the Retributors V 1 Exorcists, for the Necron-Tailoring. I was suggesting that choice in order to make it "non-tailored". But still effective against the Crons.
(IE my suggestions were to enable the list to face pretty much anything, while still being effective against Necrons)
My FLGS is running a combat patrol tournament over Adepticon weekend, I'm trying to decide now between my Sisters and my Blood Angels. The tournament will use Adepticon's Combat Patrol rules. Basically, 400 pts, codex-only, 1+ troops, 0-1 of everything else. AV over 12 becomes 12, wounds over 2 become 2, no unique units.
She would have EASILY been my first choice, yeah. I panicked at the thought of taking a canoness before I realized that HQs weren't mandatory.
I figure in the list above, the BSS and immo will be able to punch through the av12 maximum all day, and all of the squads can at least threaten armor in assault if it comes to it. The rets will be dangerous to most things on the table except maybe heavy infantry, and the seraphim can harass, get to objectives, and thin out hordes. Is there anything I'm missing?
So I'd replace the Seraphim with 5 Celestians rocking a HF, Flamer and a Rhino. I'd probably drop the simulacrum and the melta bombs to make up the points difference. I don't like hand flamers and the Rhino adds an extra scoring unit and lets you box out the infantry to protect them from charges when used in conjunction with the immolator.
PanzerLeader wrote: So I'd replace the Seraphim with 5 Celestians rocking a HF, Flamer and a Rhino. I'd probably drop the simulacrum and the melta bombs to make up the points difference. I don't like hand flamers and the Rhino adds an extra scoring unit and lets you box out the infantry to protect them from charges when used in conjunction with the immolator.
Green is Best! wrote: Why not an immo full of melta Dominion goodness? That will put a hurt on anything they can field.
I'd combine both ideas and say replace the Seraphim with 4 Melta Doms, taking the flamers on the BSS instead. As Panzer says, extra Rhino for scoring, more melta (possibly) and you keep the anti-Horde flamers. Put the BSS in a Rhino too and they need to get through it to get to your flamer (Seraphim can be quite squishy).
Also, the 4 melta doms can re-purpose for the Anti-heavy infantry once they've popped that AV12
Troops-
Battle Sister Squad, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Rhino 115
Fast Attack-
Dominions Squad, 3xMeltagun, Rhino 135
Heavy Support-
6 Retributors, 4x HB, Simulacrum, VSS 144
394 pts
With 5 point to spare: Either swap the Heavy Flamer for a Flamer and get another Melta, Storm bolter for a Sister superior, or a Dozer blade if there's terrain around.
Hey guys, massive self-doubt moment right now:
Unit Composition: 1 Rhino
Wargear: Storm bolter, searchlight, smoke launchers
Options: - Rhinos may take items from the Adepta Sororitas Vehicle Equipment list.
A model can take up to one of each of the
following:
- Storm bolter - pts
Please remind me why Rhinos cannot take a Storm bolter from the Vehicle options? I mean, "logically", why can we not have 2 Storm Bolters?
That's not bad, blacktalos, although losing the range from the MM immo kind of hurts, and I'll have to check missions but they might be on a 4x4. Dom scouting really helps to make that up though. The 5 extra could go to a flamer for the doms, give them slightly more versatility and discourage assault.
In a rhino, I'd almost consider 2 melta, 2 flamer.
Zefig wrote: That's not bad, blacktalos, although losing the range from the MM immo kind of hurts, and I'll have to check missions but they might be on a 4x4. Dom scouting really helps to make that up though. The 5 extra could go to a flamer for the doms, give them slightly more versatility and discourage assault.
In a rhino, I'd almost consider 2 melta, 2 flamer.
Yeah, i thought of the loss of the MM range, but then it's not a 2000pts game where you need it. I'm sure there will be some fully mechanised lists, but it won't be a lot of models at 400pts... Say the enemy manages to get 3 Dreadnoughts, pop 1, retributors should rend a second and you just have 1 Dread to worry about. Sure the MM could get it, but it'd be the game done already.
I also like the Idea of the extra flamer on the Doms. Real shame the Act o Faith has absolutely NO use lol... 2 melta 2 flamer would really leave you without Anti-Armour though, if there is no Immolator.
I also like the Idea of the extra flamer on the Doms. Real shame the Act o Faith has absolutely NO use lol... 2 melta 2 flamer would really leave you without Anti-Armour though, if there is no Immolator.
How would going from 3 to 2 meltas leave me without anti-armor? I'm only going to be firing 2 from the rhino hatch anyway, and the options of a scouting rhino with 2 flamers and 2 ignores cover meltas are pretty nice.
I also like the Idea of the extra flamer on the Doms. Real shame the Act o Faith has absolutely NO use lol... 2 melta 2 flamer would really leave you without Anti-Armour though, if there is no Immolator.
How would going from 3 to 2 meltas leave me without anti-armor? I'm only going to be firing 2 from the rhino hatch anyway, and the options of a scouting rhino with 2 flamers and 2 ignores cover meltas are pretty nice.
Less anti-armour, sorry, not "without". I was also still considering my usual "rush forward, jump out from the immo, and pop"
2 of each firing from a Rhino driving around does sound adequate, although that leave you with more points and i feel the 3rd melta would be useful for when you do end up jumping out. 2 flamers to protect from charging is probably quite useful though......
Yeah, i thought of the loss of the MM range, but then it's not a 2000pts game where you need it. I'm sure there will be some fully mechanised lists, but it won't be a lot of models at 400pts...
Say the enemy manages to get 3 Dreadnoughts, pop 1, retributors should rend a second and you just have 1 Dread to worry about. Sure the MM could get it, but it'd be the game done already.
I also like the Idea of the extra flamer on the Doms. Real shame the Act o Faith has absolutely NO use lol... 2 melta 2 flamer would really leave you without Anti-Armour though, if there is no Immolator.
You could spend the extra 5pts on a dual-Storm bolter Rhino?
If you move the Rhino (which is the whole reason why you took it right? To move Infantry squads around?) you have to snap-shot the 2nd storm bolter. It's a pretty pointless upgrade for a Rhino imo. I think there's better uses of 5pts - flamers, melta-bombs or even a storm-bolter on a superior.
A request on another forum led me to come up with some Sisters/BA lists. Dammit, now I want to build BA.
Team Event (Soft local 2k event)
Spoiler:
Uriah Jacobus - 100 (with Retributors) 8 BSS with Melta/Flamer in Rhino - 175 (Put in reserve) 9 BSS with Melta/Flamer in Rhino - 175 (Put in reserve) 10 Dominions with 4 Melta, Veteran with Combi-Melta, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod) 10 Dominions with 4 Melta, Veteran with Combi-Melta, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod) 10 Dominions with 4 Melta, Veteran with Combi-Melta, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod) 10 Retributors with 4 HF, Veteran with Combi-Flamer, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod) 10 Retributors with 4 HF, Veteran with Combi-Flamer, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod) 8 Retributors with 4 HF, Veteran with Combi-Flamer, Simulacrum Imperialis (In Drop Pod with Uriah and Librarian) Aegis with Comm Relay (Have one squad of scouts touching)
6 Drop Pods - 210 Librarian 65 (with Retributors) 7 Scouts with HB - 85 5 Scouts with HB - 63 1998
Ordo Open (Competitive ITC)
Spoiler:
St Celestine - 135 (with Sang Guard) 5 BSS with Flamer x2 in Immolator - 130 (In reserve) 10 BSS with Melta/Heavy Flamer/Meltabomb - 140 (In Drop Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 HF (Pod) - 100 (In Drop Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 HF (Pod) - 100 (In Drop Pod) 7 Retributors with 4 HB, Veteran and Simulacrum - 132 (In Bastion) Bastion with Comms - 105
6 Drop Pods - 210 Sanguinary Priest with Angel's Wing and Power Weapon - 95 (with Sang Guard) 5 Scouts - 55 5 Scouts - 55 7 Sanguinary Guard with 3 Inferno Pistols (261) 1850
Ordo Open Competitive Obsec List
Spoiler:
1850 Uriah (with Rets in Bastion) - 100 5 BSS with 2 Flamers in TL-MM Immo - 130 5 BSS with 2 Flamers in TL-MM Immo - 130 5 BSS with 2 Flamers in TL-MM Immo - 130 5 BSS with 2 Flamers in TL-MM Immo - 130 5 BSS with 2 Meltas - 80 (Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) - 105 (In Drop Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 HF (Pod) - 100 (In Drop Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 HF (Pod) - 100 (In Drop Pod) 7 Retributors with 4 HB, Veteran and Simulacrum - 132 (In Bastion) Bastion with Comms - 105
Roll div and place him appropriately based on what you get.
You could also swap him for a sang priest, roll on strategic and hide him in the bastion. I'm sure you could find points for the extra strategic trait.
I like the Celestine list better though, because Celestine with fnp is hilarious.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Yeah, drop a scout and a ret and you can get the strategic relic. That'd be pretty funny. Infiltrate the bastion, rets and Celestine's squad. Drop pod the rest.
Do you think exorcists are must-have unit for SOB?
Sob model is hard to collect where I'm living in, I don't have the exorcist model yet so I'm not using the exorcist for now. I'm cover the long-range fire from the IG Ally.
This is my current roster and I need some help. Can you guys point up the problem of this?
Spoiler:
+++ New Roster (1998pts) +++
++ Adepta Sororitas: Codex (2013) (Combined Arms Detachment) ++ + HQ + Ministorum Priest [Close Combat Weapon, Laspistol, The Litanies of Faith] Ministorum Priest [Close Combat Weapon, Laspistol, The Book of St. Lucius] Saint Celestine Uriah Jacobus, Protector of the Faith
Well, you're running SOB as allies, so it is a bit of a different proposition. If you have good ranged otherwise, Exorcists are not necessary. If you are running a standard SOB list though, 2-3 are almost required.
BlackTalos wrote: You could spend the extra 5pts on a dual-Storm bolter Rhino?
If you move the Rhino (which is the whole reason why you took it right? To move Infantry squads around?) you have to snap-shot the 2nd storm bolter. It's a pretty pointless upgrade for a Rhino imo. I think there's better uses of 5pts - flamers, melta-bombs or even a storm-bolter on a superior.
Oh, of course there can be much better uses for 5 pts, but in the example list, everyone is equipped =)
As for snap shooting: You tend to snap shoot it most of the time anyway. My Rhinos are usually going 12" to reach the enemy and then get destroyed or have served their purpose. It is quite rare for them to be cruisin' around at 6" per Turn unharmed :p
PanzerLeader wrote: Bastions deploy as units and the only restriction on Master of Ambush is "non-vehicle units." I don't see why it couldn't work that way.
When determining if a building can be (...) affected by a special rule, treat the building as a vehicle unless specifically stated otherwise.
I have it as Buildings are pretty much Vehicles:
Buildings of all types use aspects of the Transport vehicle rules. The main difference between buildings and actual vehicles is that they can’t move, they can be controlled by either side and units from either side can embark upon them.
(Both from the Rulebook)
Building are not vehicles but are treated as vehicles for pretty much all of the rules? I suppose you can play on the grey area for this, but some opponents would have trouble agreeing to this =P
ELDAR FARSEER: Yesss -- my prescient vision gives me perfect understanding of the battlef...
GUARDIAN: Holy crap, where did THAT come from?
FARSEER: Wha? Huh?
GUARDIAN: The Fortress of Retribution right behind you.
Automatically Appended Next Post: And a FoR is multiple buildings, so that wouldn't work.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Here's a slightly different pod list with 9 pods (for 5 first turn). Loses the awesome Celestine bomb, but still...
Uriah (in Bastion for fearless/counter-attack bubble and extra faith) 5 BSS in Immo (TL-MM) with Flamer x2 9 BSS with 2xFlamer (Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) 5 Dominions with 4 Melta (Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 Heavy Flamers (Pod) 5 Retributors with 4 Heavy Flamers (Pod) 6 Retributors with 4 HB, Simulacrum Bastion with Comms
6 Drop Pods Sanguinary Priest with Veritas Vitae (Warlord, Extra Strategic, Bastion?) Tac Squad with HF, Combi-Flamer in Drop Pod Scout Squad 5 Sternguard in Drop Pod 5 Sternguard in Drop Pod 1840
SisterSydney wrote: ELDAR FARSEER: Yesss -- my prescient vision gives me perfect understanding of the battlef...
GUARDIAN: Holy crap, where did THAT come from?
FARSEER: Wha? Huh?
GUARDIAN: The Fortress of Retribution right behind you.
The God (-Emperor) works in mysterious ways!
Besides, everyone knows that (Acts of) Faith can move mountains. A few bastions should be easy.
If somebody rode roughshod over the RAI like that, and bent the rules as written... I would cheerfully allow them to infiltrate a bastion. The existing rules allow a faction to construct towers in range and line of sight of entire Vengeance Weapon Batteries... at least sneaking fortresses have the Rule Of Funny backing them.
Just curious if you guys think it is worth it to ally in SoB. I am having a little bit of a conflict as to ally them in to an Eldar army or to just stay with Eldar throughout. Do these two synergize well together?
toocool61 wrote: Just curious if you guys think it is worth it to ally in SoB. I am having a little bit of a conflict as to ally them in to an Eldar army or to just stay with Eldar throughout. Do these two synergize well together?
I'm not sure what allying SOB to eldar would do for you. As allies to the IoM, they are great. Allying with foul Xenos? Not so much.
toocool61 wrote: Just curious if you guys think it is worth it to ally in SoB. I am having a little bit of a conflict as to ally them in to an Eldar army or to just stay with Eldar throughout. Do these two synergize well together?
Heh. The idea of an infiltrating bastion made me chuckle. Whilst I can see the arguement, I'm more inclined to think it wouldn't be legal. Besides I don't think I'd play it that way....
As a BA player 'm a little sad to see the dex is only good for providing drop pods and a relic for two warlord traits (I really do love that relic!).
Amusing enough, Planetstrike actually used Deep Striking bastions, so it isn't even a new idea in the fluff.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
evildrcheese wrote: As a BA player 'm a little sad to see the dex is only good for providing drop pods and a relic for two warlord traits (I really do love that relic!).
So I just returned back to the hobby and found out my local game store is now allowing apocalypse formation in normal games (haven't played since 6th edition). So I was thinking of Angelic Host Formation. Tell me what you guys think:
990 Points
Saint Celestine
2x10 Seraphims with Superior, Melta Bomb and 2x2 hand Flamers
2x10 Seraphims with Superior, Melta Bomb and 2x2 Inferno Pistols and plasma pistol
SisterSydney wrote: ELDAR FARSEER: Yesss -- my prescient vision gives me perfect understanding of the battlef...
GUARDIAN: Holy crap, where did THAT come from?
FARSEER: Wha? Huh?
GUARDIAN: The Fortress of Retribution right behind you.
SisterSydney wrote: ELDAR FARSEER: Yesss -- my prescient vision gives me perfect understanding of the battlef...
GUARDIAN: Holy crap, where did THAT come from?
FARSEER: Wha? Huh?
GUARDIAN: The Fortress of Retribution right behind you.
SisterSydney wrote: ELDAR FARSEER: Yesss -- my prescient vision gives me perfect understanding of the battlef...
GUARDIAN: Holy crap, where did THAT come from?
FARSEER: Wha? Huh?
GUARDIAN: The Fortress of Retribution right behind you.
The God (-Emperor) works in mysterious ways!
Besides, everyone knows that (Acts of) Faith can move mountains. A few bastions should be easy.
If somebody rode roughshod over the RAI like that, and bent the rules as written... I would cheerfully allow them to infiltrate a bastion. The existing rules allow a faction to construct towers in range and line of sight of entire Vengeance Weapon Batteries... at least sneaking fortresses have the Rule Of Funny backing them.
SO many ways to make it viable in fluff, i was just saying the games where the opponent has to agree "buildings use all the rules for Vehicle, are just like Vehicles... ...but they're not !" will not always go down well. Plus anyone could do it is that Warlord trait.
Fluff-wise you could find anything, from cloaking fields (Not very AS) to bastions on tracks (they can be very quiet you know...) and air-dropped bastions (why do you think they look so pristine and well-placed? )
Anyone played Dawn of War? You must know how they actually bring in buildings, lol
Space Marines need a lot of Power Generators, true fluff Fact ! Heresy if you think otherwise
toocool61 wrote: Yeah that is what I was thinking as well. All it would really add is four ignore cover meltas with great first turn range, and Celestine.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Thanks for the reply!
Yeah, i don't think they would bring much to Eldar, as they are the same toughness, similar mid-range options with Acts of Faith instead of "magic".
You're better off going for more toughness (Space Marines), more shooting (Tau), or more mobility (Dark Eldar).
Wow, this thread got long again. How is it that Games Workshop who you know has a prowler here or there, sees this and doesnt give us a hardbound book, but the frigging Harlequins get one?
There's a whole bunch of them, up for a few days now. Came across them searching for deals.
Other words, I've a game coming up and intend to ally my Elysians with Sisters to provide close in fire support and rapid deployment. Will see how it goes.
pretre wrote: Games workshop doesn't do market research.
I've always had a vague feeling that they go by Sales. As pure numbers. How many Special Editions of Astra militarum & Orks were sold, and how fast = Now they do limited edition.
Similar trends for anything that sold "a lot and fast".
They did not make the link between "good Codex" = more sales though (Necrons 4-5th Ed, etc) , so it must literally be: "How many of "A" did we sell? Make more of that"
My FLGS will be running an escalation campaign with special campaign character rules starting in a little over a month. The campaign will scale from 1500 pt and 1000 pt doubles to 2250 pt and 1500 pt doubles. The campaign character rules let you pick a non-unique HQ (or potentially a non-unique model or unit from elsewhere in the codex with 3 or less wounds/hull) and give them bonuses, special rules, and the opportunity to steal wargear from another codex. The full character rules are here.
At the moment I only have the BA dex, but would be very willing to grab the inquisition dex and less willing to shell out for others. This does represent an opportunity to make a flying nun again, at long last. And possibly more. I believe I could steal artificer armor and either a jump pack or bike from the blood angels. Take the cloak, mantle, rosarius, and eviscerator from the Sisters dex. Use campaign character rules to bump her str to 4, give the eviscerator fleshbane, and take something like fnp, rage, furious charge, or hit and run. All this together would take her cost to somewhere in the range of 230, however.
Worth it? And given that stack up of rerollable 2+/4++, EW, and possibly fnp would this risk going afoul of the campaign rule "don't be a douche?"
Wouldn't the 1 pt in invulnerable only take her to a 5++ from the shield of faith 6++? I don't think I'd mind paying for tha rosarius to put that character point into fnp or fleshbane.
Don't think any of their HQ characters have that, nor is it in the generic war-gear list.
(If you can take any unit's upgrade, the obvious answer would be grav-cannon + grav-amp and artificer armor from SM.)
Automatically Appended Next Post: So the wording seems open to abuse though:
"Choose any non-Named, non-unique unit from your codex HQ selections. Alternately, an infantry model
(including jump infantry, jet pack infantry, etc.) that is normally purchased as part of a squad may be
selected at its “additional models” point cost. The model gains the “independent character” type in
addition to its normal type. "
Would that allow you to pick a command squad and gain the benefits on every model? (I'm assuming no.)
Automatically Appended Next Post: Because a battle conclave would be amazing if they all got +1S, +1W, a 4++ on the DCAs, EW, and better AP or something crazy like that.
The other interesting choice would be an IG tank commander. A LR with some of those upgrades could do some nasty things. Most wouldn't apply, but you could get a 4++ on an AV14 model.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Actually, the more I think of it the more I think building the biggest most-badass hero might be the wrong tack.
You could instead do something like:
Crusader, on a bike with a frost axe = 66 pts. (Assuming 2 pieces isn't 2 points?)
Give him +1S, Shred and Extra wound. (I'm assuming non-standard character is also 1 pt.)
Or do the same with a DCA and a sword, keeping the model cheap, but effective at dealing with enemy squads of regular dudes.
With a DCA, you could even just not put any upgrades on to pay 18 points for a 2W model with 3 S5 AP2 attacks at I6, rerollable. She'd need a squad to be in, but... 18 points for that...
It is taking up a lot of space...I'm pretty satisfied with using an EW Biker Canoness with Eviscerator though. I'll run it by the organizers, and start a new thread if they don't approve her. Thanks for the help, everyone!
So, weirdly, my Blood angels had a game AGAINST Sisters of battle a few weeks ago and I finally got the video edited together. It's not the narrative type that I usually post, just a fun game.
Celtic Strike wrote: So, weirdly, my Blood angels had a game AGAINST Sisters of battle a few weeks ago and I finally got the video edited together. It's not the narrative type that I usually post, just a fun game.
Thanks great report - enjoyed that alot - Sheld of Faith saves - awesoem when they are yours
Not to derail too much, but I wrote up a hasty piece of campaign prologue about the biker Smashbabe from a few posts up. Figured I'd shameless promote it.
What's everyone think of Skitarii re: Sisters? Potential choice for allies with their crazy specialized shooting?
Skitarii rangers have some nice potential as fire support, and... well. Those chocobo knights look like they'd be a great way to screen a penitent engine rush!
Furyou Miko wrote: Skitarii rangers have some nice potential as fire support, and... well. Those chocobo knights look like they'd be a great way to screen a penitent engine rush!
Yeah, i can see a pretty good combo there, also depending on what other Units AdMech will get.
I can somehow expect some heavy tank, or at least something durable (Cyber-warriors? 3+ Save and FNP etc?). At the moment there is quite a big "Glass canon" feel about the army, but that would not be too much of a downside... Just thinking it might not combine well with our T3..
I was thinking about ally potential as well, but then a fluff thought occurred to me. Don't the AdMech and AS not get along very well? I mean sure the AdMech keeps our cranky Exorcists in tune and gear, but besides that, there's that whole Machine God thing to think about.
Or am I misremembering again? (I hope so, those infantry models are sweet.)
BlackTalos wrote: So, anyone looking forward to the new Kickstarter tomorrow?
I haven't got much to throw at it, but i will try... =P
Sheesh - 300k in two hours isn't too shabby. I'm thinking about jumping in just because I've always wanted a small sisters allied force, but there's just something about raging heroes's sculpts... They just rub me the wrong way. I mean, they're beautiful. They really are. Some of their dark elf stuff is reeeeaaaally tempting for a DE Haemonculus stand in - but do you get the feeling that every single model is like, *strike a pose!*? To an obnoxious extent? I understand that design impulse for character models. You want them to stand out after all. But if I'm picking up ~20+ sisters, at least some of them just need to be standing there holding a bolt gun, right? Instead of hopping on one leg, doing a handstand, or just twerking her high-heeled butt off?
Hoitash wrote: I was thinking about ally potential as well, but then a fluff thought occurred to me. Don't the AdMech and AS not get along very well? I mean sure the AdMech keeps our cranky Exorcists in tune and gear, but besides that, there's that whole Machine God thing to think about.
Or am I misremembering again? (I hope so, those infantry models are sweet.)
No, you are right. The Mechanicus don't follow the Imperial Cult, instead following their own Cult Mechanicus which views the Emperor as the Omnissiah, and the Ecclesiarchy has some pretty major issues with that. But kinda like the Space Marine chapters, they're reluctantly allowed to get away with it because the Imperium can't afford to lose them.
Mavnas wrote: Yeah, I don't really like their design. Besides, I have over 100 SoB infantry models.
Yeah, I'm falling out with it. I'd have to spend a good 300-400 (which is cheap) to redo my army with them and I'd have to repaint everything.
The good news is that it would be practically free since I could just sell my old SOB, but still...
Also, I was thinking of just getting one or two models (Revallia and Ascended Erzebel) but shipping being 20-30 is killing it for me.
I'm quite happy joining some more feet on the ground to my current forces. Just some "higher up" sisters to be part of my main army. Count-as Celestians (That's a hope for the new Codex...), even on a fluff point of view: play them as standard BSS but call them celestians. Also, looks like their versions of Penitent Engines are coming up. I do not own any, so my purchase might just be 9 of those.
I can go on for ideas, but the conclusion would be the same: I'm in for it
I'm liking "Arthenia VI, the Arch-Papess" more and more as a form of Cardinal for the fluff side. It started when i realised she did not have daemon horns but a Victorian Queen-type collar....
Aye, I am planning on picking up a handful of squads and using them to add some much needed diversity to my already existing SOB army. Being able to point to the unit and say "yes, those are dominions" because the miniatures are different (and standout!) rather than just because they have a different hair color will be much appreciated.
I'm loving the minis but am still on the fence about it as I've heard that the company is slow to produce the models. I understand that KS can sometimes take a while, but from what I've seen / heard they only just shipped out the final models from the initial one, and it ended about a year and a half ago. Basically I'm wondering what experiences people have had with them in the past? Is it worth it to wait over a year for the models? I already have a full sisters army so this would just be gravy, which is what is making me hesitate, especially with rumors getting louder that Sisters may actually get a plastic release (I know, I know, but the rumors do seem to be getting more legit lately).
confoo22 wrote: I'm loving the minis but am still on the fence about it as I've heard that the company is slow to produce the models. I understand that KS can sometimes take a while, but from what I've seen / heard they only just shipped out the final models from the initial one, and it ended about a year and a half ago. Basically I'm wondering what experiences people have had with them in the past? Is it worth it to wait over a year for the models? I already have a full sisters army so this would just be gravy, which is what is making me hesitate, especially with rumors getting louder that Sisters may actually get a plastic release (I know, I know, but the rumors do seem to be getting more legit lately).
If you have a full Sisters army, I think investing in this KS would be a mistake. You will not take delivery of your full investment for a significant period of time, and I'm highly dubious of any company that relies on Kickstarter as a means of running a business.
Hoitash wrote: I was thinking about ally potential as well, but then a fluff thought occurred to me. Don't the AdMech and AS not get along very well? I mean sure the AdMech keeps our cranky Exorcists in tune and gear, but besides that, there's that whole Machine God thing to think about.
Or am I misremembering again? (I hope so, those infantry models are sweet.)
No, you are right. The Mechanicus don't follow the Imperial Cult, instead following their own Cult Mechanicus which views the Emperor as the Omnissiah, and the Ecclesiarchy has some pretty major issues with that. But kinda like the Space Marine chapters, they're reluctantly allowed to get away with it because the Imperium can't afford to lose them.
As a rules matter, though, I'd imagine GW will stick with the rule that "all forces of the Imperium are Battle Brothers to each other." And fluffwise, you could say your Canoness/Cardinal is unusually ecumenical, pragmatic, or desperate.
Automatically Appended Next Post: For example:
CANONESS: Welcome, ally, in the name of the God-Emperor!
MAGOS: You. Mean. Omnissiah.
CANONESS: We all adore in our own way, brother. Just as long as you feel His love in your heart!
MAGOS: My. Heart. Is. Plastic.
CANONESS: As long as you feel His love in whatever part of you is still human!
MAGOS: My. Brain. Spinal column. Left kidney. And. Prostate.
CANONESS: As long as you feel His love in your prostate!
MAGOS: You. Nuns. Don't. Even. Know. Why. That. Sounds. Wrong. Do. You?
CANONESS: Nope!
If you have a full Sisters army, I think investing in this KS would be a mistake. You will not take delivery of your full investment for a significant period of time, and I'm highly dubious of any company that relies on Kickstarter as a means of running a business.
I disagree, for me at least, since the KS has so many other armies involved I always have the option of taking the sister freebies and using some of the dark elves to add to my dark elf wyches "counts as" daemonettes army.
They have already dropped the "scout" freebie which makes me hopeful that they will have something that can replace my daughters of the flame "counts as" flesh tearer scouts that unlock drop pods for my penitent engines as well as a jump pack sanguinary priest for fnp on my seraphim Celestine bodyguards.
Of course I am looking more for the dark elves, but the sister stuff has some possibilities as far as filling some niches in my "counts as" units. For those looking to start a new Sisters army, like Petre said, you can get a lot of models cheap. To each their own thoug, the KS works for me.
BTW, is it actually possible to drag this thread OT?
IMO, the Mantic stuff doesn't fit the GW aesthetic very well. And that's discounting the fact that the vast majority of the line is just concept art at this point. We have no idea what it will look like when the rubber meets the road. It's important to me that my army look like an army, not a collection of stuff that shares the same paint scheme.
When will the last wave reach your doorstep? This is six completely new factions. I just don't see this being fulfilled in 12 months. Too many variables between here and there. I'll bet a lot of people didn't count on a port strike in the US, right? If I didn't have an existing Sisters army, I'd be more than a little concerned that plastic Sisters showed up before all of this stuff did.
But, if none of the above bothers you, or you just love the way Mantic's stuff looks, or your willing to compromise a bit to save some money, then your opinion is just as valid as mine. I'm just sharing why I would avoid the investment.
I have some Raging heroes models already. I bought some preying mantis models from them a few months back (they look like daemonettes if anyone is wondering).
Firstly, I must say I have extremely happy with the sculpt, it was clean and crisp and the details were beautiful. The build method allows for a good amounts of poses too, they have these ball-jointed shoulders that allow total control of where the arm is posed. The only part that bothered me is the... size, kinda. You see they were prettymuch the same height as the GW daemonettes, maybe a hair shorter, but they are wildly thinner, like stick thin. Putting them next to any GW model they seem so thin and frail and definitely stand out from the other GW stuff, you can tell they are made from a different company.
Don't get me wrong, I love them and they still look superb but I can clearly see what the_armyman is getting at when he says he wants his units to have some aesthetic cohesion. If you are building an army out of Raging heroes models then it'll look fantastic but mixing them in with GW models they do look different in scale and style. In the end I'm still happy with how they look in my army, especially since GW newer daemonettes look so terrible. Just wanted to give some firsthand knowledge with my experiences with the company doing this "sisters clone" army KS. By the way the company is filled with wonderful and fun people, I emailed them about address changes and for updates on the TGG KS and they are super-quick to reply with lots of info and everything. As a company, regardless of how they fund their projects, I can say I like them.
Ok I'm sure I've filled this thread with enough heresy for one night so I will add this: Anyone thinking the new skiitarii stuff can add to the Sisters dex in any areas they are lacking? Perhaps the ironstriders can offer some non-melta AT or free up heavy slots for more HB rets?
So, I like the new AdMech models, but I find it hard to see how they would work well with a SoB force. The most interesting thing the troops seem to be able to do is to bring a bunch of haywire guns to bear, you know for those times when 12 melta guns and a couple of exorcists aren't enough. If they were at least long-range anti-tank then they'd bring something new. I guess I will have to see what their transports look like.
More out of curiostity than anything, but will this thread be "reset" (Abandoned) if a new Codex is released?
I mean if the Codex contains pretty much the same Units but slightly modded then most of the discussion still applies? I suppose no one is going to go civ through the thread, ever...?
Automatically Appended Next Post: I'll hold off on the Mechanicus until I see the rules. I made a promise to GW back in 2003 that if they released a mechanicum army I would buy it. (I had Mechanicum ships for Gothic if you're wondering) Not sure how they would mesh with the Sisters but I have Space marines/Blood angels as well so I'm sure I'll find a way.
On an unrelated note, I finally edited together another battle report for the Sisters. Life keeps getting in the way.
I wouldn't hold off on the Kickstarter hoping for plastic Sisters. I sold my whole army thinking plastics were right around the corner right after the new Codex came out and we saw how those rumors panned out!
That said I am going to use this opportunity to rebuild my army. It will cost at least $300 just to replace all my troops (not even counting rebuying all the tanks) but I can actually get enough meltaguns this time and only pay $3 a piece.
Right now I am trying to figure out what all to get without going overboard. So tempting to buy 3 full units of their amazing looking Repentia for instance. I want to get a unit of the Fantasy Angels for a third unit of Seraphim (as an honor guard for Celestine) when I will probably never run three. I want some of the Fantasy Sisters to throw boltguns on and use as Celestians and I even will buy a unit of the Daughters (badass combat nuns with dual pistols) just because they look cool. Plus about 85 Sisters, almost every character, and at least one of the Thrones of Judgement.
Anyone thought of going special weapon crazy with their BSS?
I'm talking Flamer/Melta with heavy flamer, a combo-plasma and a priest with a plasma in a 5-10 girl squad in a rhino or immolator? That's a lot of firepower IMO. Though somewhat expensive and squishy.
Furyou Miko wrote: Too spendy, although I occasionally toss a couple of plasma pistols on my melta-minion superior for lols.
You can do that? Give them two I mean thought that was reserved for seraphim? That does sound fun.
It's a little spendy but I don't know I rarely find my BSS do a whole lot and thought it might be a better way to get some oomph out of them. I might drop the priest though. That might be a little too much.
Anyone who can take ranged weapons from the armoury can take dual pistols. Except the seraphim superior, for some odd reason. I ran the combi plasma, flamer, heavy flamer, with priest and a plasma gun in a multimelta Immolator. I've run that a few times.I ran that against the necros up top. It's okay, a bit spendy but it's fun.
I'm slowly going through the thread here and it's almost surprising how much things are still like the tactics in the old one. I do like the allied drop pod army idea above though!
I've decided I will be using the RH Daughters of the Crucible as Scouts. About how many scouts do I reasonably need assuming I have to get them all at once? 12, 16, or go for even more? They will be in multiples of 4.
Malkyr wrote: I'm slowly going through the thread here and it's almost surprising how much things are still like the tactics in the old one. I do like the allied drop pod army idea above though!
I've decided I will be using the RH Daughters of the Crucible as Scouts. About how many scouts do I reasonably need assuming I have to get them all at once? 12, 16, or go for even more? They will be in multiples of 4.
So I'm looking to start sisters and I figured this would probably be the best place do advise.
I have around $150 and a medium sized tau army $150-200 to sell so I would love to get some advise.
Plan on using them as allies to my guard until I can get them up to a reasonable size.
My idea was to grab Celestine, 2 squads of sisters in rhinos w melta or flamers, and them a squad of seraphim as a start.
Any help is welcome!
Clockwork Iron wrote: So I'm looking to start sisters and I figured this would probably be the best place do advise.
I have around $150 and a medium sized tau army $150-200 to sell so I would love to get some advise.
Plan on using them as allies to my guard until I can get them up to a reasonable size.
My idea was to grab Celestine, 2 squads of sisters in rhinos w melta or flamers, and them a squad of seraphim as a start.
Any help is welcome!
Clockwork Iron wrote: So I'm looking to start sisters and I figured this would probably be the best place do advise.
I have around $150 and a medium sized tau army $150-200 to sell so I would love to get some advise.
Plan on using them as allies to my guard until I can get them up to a reasonable size.
My idea was to grab Celestine, 2 squads of sisters in rhinos w melta or flamers, and them a squad of seraphim as a start.
Any help is welcome!
Casual or competitive play?
Kind of in between, it doesn't really matter to me really, except that there needs to be seraphim in the list, such gorgeous models.
Lol, yeah I'm constantly browsing eBay, as well as swap shop. Next time I'm at the flgs I'll send out my feelers as well, in search of the rare and elusive sisters of battle, lol!
Furyou Miko wrote: Too spendy, although I occasionally toss a couple of plasma pistols on my melta-minion superior for lols.
You can do that? Give them two I mean thought that was reserved for seraphim? That does sound fun.
It's a little spendy but I don't know I rarely find my BSS do a whole lot and thought it might be a better way to get some oomph out of them. I might drop the priest though. That might be a little too much.
I've had some great fun with the Gunsligner Plasma-Girl Veteran in my Dominions. Very spendy for a Squad that dies on turn 1 (often) but so much fun when it kills stuff. And just rule of cool really.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/623392-Dominion%20Squad.html?m=2
Plug! lol (They are finished now btw, but never got to taking new pics yet......)
Having just pledged a good amount in Raging Heroes TGG2 Kickstarter I will be joining your ranks... eventually.
I am currently looking at getting the following models with my pledge and would appreciate any feedback on numbers. Keep in mind I will be getting Immos/rhinos/exorcists at a later date.
Celestine proxy 7 "hero" models *4 of the freebies Sisters proxy - 50 models Repentia proxy - 10 models seraphim proxy - 10 models Death cult assassin - 5 models (the daughters models could not pass up at least 1 box) Celestian proxy - 10 models (the termie models, may use them for SM allies or something, could not pass up at least 1 box troop and command of these though) Pentant Engine proxy - 2 models
The following are from TGG1, can not change these numbers and I want to use the models. Dominion proxy - 30 models (Jailbird troopers) Retributor proxy - 10 models (Jailbirds artillery piece is the heavy weapon model spotters are standard sisters)
The middle one is a bit "meh", plus i think i glued it a bit high on her (or also the angle of the picture) and could do with better painting. (Many excuses.... lol) But i quite like it.
Having just pledged a good amount in Raging Heroes TGG2 Kickstarter I will be joining your ranks... eventually.
I am currently looking at getting the following models with my pledge and would appreciate any feedback on numbers. Keep in mind I will be getting Immos/rhinos/exorcists at a later date.
Celestine proxy
7 "hero" models *4 of the freebies
Sisters proxy - 50 models
Repentia proxy - 10 models
seraphim proxy - 10 models
Death cult assassin - 5 models (the daughters models could not pass up at least 1 box)
Celestian proxy - 10 models (the termie models, may use them for SM allies or something, could not pass up at least 1 box troop and command of these though)
Pentant Engine proxy - 2 models
The following are from TGG1, can not change these numbers and I want to use the models.
Dominion proxy - 30 models (Jailbird troopers)
Retributor proxy - 10 models (Jailbirds artillery piece is the heavy weapon model spotters are standard sisters)
Anything else I need to try an cover?
As pretre put it, when you say "Sisters proxy - 50 models", think of this:
pretre wrote: So from the previous KS, is there any reason to get the troopers as opposed to the command? I.e. Does the command have all the bits from the troopers PLUS the command bits or are they different?
Like, if I wanted to make a 5 girl BSS squad, I need 2 heavies/specials and a sergeant. Seems like Command is the way to go.
Yeah, i'd say "body" poses are different, heads etc too.
So getting 1 of each would provide flexibility, etc. only if you want more than 5... if just 5 then yeah, i'd go Command Squad =)
Pretty much my max MSU. Works out to 12 bolters, 12 Sgts, 36 Special/Heavies. 60 Girls. 60 Girls is 12 Command Squads, which only gets you 24 Specials, 12 Sgts, 24 Bolters. I figure converting is a thing though...
I see, thanks for that quote BlackTalos.
I think since I plan on only using the "sister proxy" models for BSS and using different models for Dominions and Retributors I should end up having enough special/heavy weps.
Also 2 Immo kits on the way already.
My first Imperial army begins!
It really depends, when we get access to the pledge manager, on whether the "normal" troops get a number of special weapons or if only the "command" version does... Choosing "all command" or getting some basic troops will be then, and only vary things by $2-3 (which you can add during selection)
So, looking at the AdMech stuff again, it looks like you can take a formation of just their walkers which gets Outflank, Acute Senses, and the ability to come in from reserves turn 1.
They're not super sturdy, but with outflank and long-range fire power you can get at least one turn of BS5+ shooting out of them and also position them in places annoying to your enemy. I'm thinking you'd want the jezzails instead of the lances?
I didn't really think the AdMech infantry would help us much, but the walkers add an interesting option if you can take them without paying any extra troops tax.
What about those melee admech dudes? The ones that make me think of General Grievous with heads ripped from the repair droids from the pod races.
I haven't seen their rules but they seem more like the stealthy melee unit to me, akin to striking scorpions. If they aren't too expensive points-wise and could easily be taken by SoB could they possibly offer us some melee speed-bumps or something? Repentia are cool but they are far too fragile with no decent way of moving around and being effective (rhinos just don't make good assault vehicles GW, when will you learn?). Perhaps if these guys are a little more durable with some decent killing potential and a way of being where they need to be, preferably sans-transport, they could be of use?
I'm well aware that 40K is a shooting game at the moment too, save for a few key units, but I never stop the search to find a decent way of making it work.
I forget what their rules were, but I seem to remember thinking adding more T3 models without transports didn't seem like a great idea.
For melee speed bumps we already have battle conclaves. They're not too expensive if you just want a unit to hold near your rear units to counter attack what comes at them. (They only get expensive with an inq land raider).
The only advantage the new Grevious-Droids have over the Conclave is movement (to me). +3" on everything, that's up to 18" move a Turn and a charge range of 15", so a possible 24" charge on Turn 1 or a coverage of up to 42" on Turn 2....
Apart form that, relatively expensive, pretty good in CC (quite "random" weapons) and still T3 IIRC.
Turn 1, Celestine and a squad of Dominions start inside, allowing you to drop a Massive Blast plasma blast that ignores cover on basically anything you want. Even if it scatters, at BS7, it can scatter at most 5". I'm not 100% on the scatter being rerollable or not, but at BS7 the Gets Hot! should also be rerollable since you're rerolling 1s.
You can upgrade the building with an escape hatch 12" forward to pop the doms out on a future turn and melta something in mid field or really 12" in whatever direction you want to extend their threat range in.
I can't quite tell where the firepoints are based on the picture, but I see at least one slot at ground level.
Actually, I think what that army needs is an inquisitor with a psyocculum. While you can't get ignores cover and BS10 at the same time, a massive blast which scatters at most 2" is going to discourage psykers from ever leaving cover.
I knew a guy that did try to make a case for sob plasma weapons though. He said that plasma weapons are described as super heated plasma like that of a small sun. Therefore it is heat based and ok by sob standards.
Also Sister Superior Myria in Faith and Fire carries a plasma pistol. Finally, several miniatures are modelled with plasma pistols.
MrFlutterPie wrote: I knew a guy that did try to make a case for sob plasma weapons though. He said that plasma weapons are described as super heated plasma like that of a small sun. Therefore it is heat based and ok by sob standards.
Also Sister Superior Myria in Faith and Fire carries a plasma pistol. Finally, several miniatures are modelled with plasma pistols.
Yeah i thought of that actually, they love their Plasma pistols but somehow they're not part of the Holy Trinity of Weapons..... Go figure.
Mavnas wrote: Problem with the pipes is you can't even reach the edge of the enemy deployment zone. There's no much your flamers can do about 24" shooting.
Now I grant you. A ret squad in a repressor next to the pipes can make for fun times, but I'd hesitate to invest more than that in it.
When I drafted up some lists with Use of the pipes, it really depends who you're playing....
A "forward" army would have you deploying behind your pipes, behind your line. But if you're playing an enemy you don't think you can reach (as above), then there is (was?) no restriction to deploying the Pipes right up to the Board mid-line (IIRC), which would put them at 12" from the enemy Line, and be much more useful.
Beware if the enemy goes first though, and actually decides to move forward (but you would've known this normally)
I think in this edition fortifications go in your deployment zone :(
Unless you infiltrate them (I rememeber this discussion somewhere. Some warlord traits that let you infiltrate a vehicle theoretically should let you sneak a building there too?)
Ah i think you are right:
"If a fortification is taken as part of an army, then it is set up with the rest of the units in the army using the same deployment rules as the other models."
Hmmmm another change that went unnoticed for me in 7th... Not that i needed to use that unless i used the promethium pipes :S
Mavnas wrote: I think in this edition fortifications go in your deployment zone :(
Unless you infiltrate them (I rememeber this discussion somewhere. Some warlord traits that let you infiltrate a vehicle theoretically should let you sneak a building there too?)
I think the warlord trait your thinking of allows you to infiltrate 3 non-vehicle units, but if you give it to a unit with a dedicated transport it allows a unit and their vehicle on infiltrate. As far as I know this only works dedicated transports, so would not be applicable to fortifications anyway.
What about Coteaz with the giant plas gun, would it benefit from the I've been expecting you?
Mavnas wrote: I think in this edition fortifications go in your deployment zone :(
Unless you infiltrate them (I rememeber this discussion somewhere. Some warlord traits that let you infiltrate a vehicle theoretically should let you sneak a building there too?)
I think the warlord trait your thinking of allows you to infiltrate 3 non-vehicle units, but if you give it to a unit with a dedicated transport it allows a unit and their vehicle on infiltrate. As far as I know this only works dedicated transports, so would not be applicable to fortifications anyway.
What about Coteaz with the giant plas gun, would it benefit from the I've been expecting you?
D
Thing is, Fortifications are a Unit in your army, but they're not Vehicles
well the fortifications thing is weird because the missions for them say your half of the board in Stronghold assault dont they? Yet in the main rb, it seems to indicate your deployment zone.
Yeah, Stronghold Assault is a 6th edition book. If it conflicted with the main rules, I think those would take precedence, since they're a newer edition.
pg 15, 16, 17, and 48 were pretty much removed and i think those hold the deployment rules.
It's not really precedence, just as DeviantDuck points out, they've been completely FAQed out of the game. Shame, promethium pipes worked really well at the mid-line and driving up to them then plugging in the Promethium inlet valve from your Rhino/Repressor into it
Are we all well-versed in Sororitas Tactics now? Just waiting for the next new Codex?
I have never played assassins in my AS army, as i never purchased the Dataslate. I know the new rules might be completely game-changing, but going by the "old" Data-slate, what are your experiences with them?
Which assassin have you used and why? How does it play, make up its points?
Honestly, looking at the new Eldar codex, I just feel like there's nothing from a Sisters army that counters either bike spam or D-weapon spam effectively and it's incredibly discouraging.
Mavnas wrote: Honestly, looking at the new Eldar codex, I just feel like there's nothing from a Sisters army that counters either bike spam or D-weapon spam effectively and it's incredibly discouraging.
I suspect my MSU sisters with AM allies will still hold up fine. Scatterbikes are not that great against AV11 and do nothing to AV13. The average 3 bike squad will do ~2 hull points in one turn against a Rhino or Immolator before cover is accounted for. We have lots of stuff to kill 3 MEQs. Exorcists and Dominions still shoot most D-weapon platforms dead.
Mavnas wrote: Honestly, looking at the new Eldar codex, I just feel like there's nothing from a Sisters army that counters either bike spam or D-weapon spam effectively and it's incredibly discouraging.
I suspect my MSU sisters with AM allies will still hold up fine. Scatterbikes are not that great against AV11 and do nothing to AV13. The average 3 bike squad will do ~2 hull points in one turn against a Rhino or Immolator before cover is accounted for. We have lots of stuff to kill 3 MEQs. Exorcists and Dominions still shoot most D-weapon platforms dead.
Yeah i'd agree that it would be quite situational.
And when it comes to D-Weapons, we are probably the best equipped. What other army can deny anything but a "6" with their own "6" on every single model?
BlackTalos wrote: Are we all well-versed in Sororitas Tactics now? Just waiting for the next new Codex?
I have never played assassins in my AS army, as i never purchased the Dataslate. I know the new rules might be completely game-changing, but going by the "old" Data-slate, what are your experiences with them?
Which assassin have you used and why? How does it play, make up its points?
I have all of the assassins and hope to start trying them out soon. I grabbed the current WD as it has a hard copy of the rules for $5 instead of $16.99 CDN for a digital dataslate. I plan of trying out he Vindicare and the Culexus first. I like the anti pysker abilities and the Vindicare has been a favorite of mine ever since 3rd.
I've used the vindicare a few times, but only when I was also playing my bastion. He's great to stick on top since you have complete view of the entire field and gets a 3 up cover save, which is nice. However, many a time a first turn lascannon wipes out 150pts. He's good for singling out enemy characters and picking off random vehicles. I'd say the vindicare usually gets its points back.
Both times i played the culexes my opponent had no psykers and he didn't really do a whole hell of a lot... But that's not the best barometer for you. To me, the other two assassins don't benefit the sisters play style enough to make them worth taking.
Mavnas wrote: Honestly, looking at the new Eldar codex, I just feel like there's nothing from a Sisters army that counters either bike spam or D-weapon spam effectively and it's incredibly discouraging.
I suspect my MSU sisters with AM allies will still hold up fine. Scatterbikes are not that great against AV11 and do nothing to AV13. The average 3 bike squad will do ~2 hull points in one turn against a Rhino or Immolator before cover is accounted for. We have lots of stuff to kill 3 MEQs. Exorcists and Dominions still shoot most D-weapon platforms dead.
Yeah i'd agree that it would be quite situational.
And when it comes to D-Weapons, we are probably the best equipped. What other army can deny anything but a "6" with their own "6" on every single model?
Mavnas wrote: Honestly, looking at the new Eldar codex, I just feel like there's nothing from a Sisters army that counters either bike spam or D-weapon spam effectively and it's incredibly discouraging.
I suspect my MSU sisters with AM allies will still hold up fine. Scatterbikes are not that great against AV11 and do nothing to AV13. The average 3 bike squad will do ~2 hull points in one turn against a Rhino or Immolator before cover is accounted for. We have lots of stuff to kill 3 MEQs. Exorcists and Dominions still shoot most D-weapon platforms dead.
Yeah i'd agree that it would be quite situational.
And when it comes to D-Weapons, we are probably the best equipped. What other army can deny anything but a "6" with their own "6" on every single model?
Dont we need d3 6s?
You roll saves first, then the d3 for number of wounds. So the D weapon sequence forces a single save, which if failed, causes d3+1 wounds.
Well, Eldar aside. I have been thinking about allies.
This may have been covered before, (This thread is so large now it is easy to miss something) but I think the Skitarii are ideal allies for the sisters. Most of the Sisters don't want to sit back and babysit an objective, they want to get up in someone's face and melt it off. But the Skitarii rangers have good range with the 30" and up to three long range sniper rifles. Add in the fact that they are essentially Tax free with no HQ tax and if you want the troops you really can't call them a tax ether. Want some anti-air? Add a dunecrawler with the 'I hate flyers smorgasbord' Want some more big guns? Well, a squad of dunecrawlers should work nicely.
Fluff wise it could be neither church trust the other with the mission so they both sent their forces to help (and keep an eye on the other).
(I also want to ally them because I have a mess of the Tech-Thralls from forgeworld and now that the Mechanics have rules in 40K proper I want to use them. I can get the oval bases from GF9 for the sniper rifles. No one in my local group would mind.)
The trouble I have with them is they're low mobility, low T troops (much like what Sisters can bring) and don't pack nearly as much long-range punch as some IG tanks and artillery.
So I have finally got myself some sisters! Any tips on what to get next would be awesome!
I am at the moment fielding them as allies to my imperial guard, who use blobs of infantry and russes mostly.
So far I have
Celestine
9 seraphim, (1 superior, 2 with hand flamers)
17 sisters (4 with melta, 1 heavy flamer)
1 rhino/immolator
1 immolator
1 exorcist
I would love to somehow use penitent engines cause the model is soooo good, even of they are kinda bad.
Clockwork Iron wrote: So I have finally got myself some sisters! Any tips on what to get next would be awesome! I am at the moment fielding them as allies to my imperial guard, who use blobs of infantry and russes mostly.
So far I have Celestine 9 seraphim, (1 superior, 2 with hand flamers) 17 sisters (4 with melta, 1 heavy flamer) 1 rhino/immolator 1 immolator 1 exorcist
I would love to somehow use penitent engines cause the model is soooo good, even of they are kinda bad.
Right now you could field: Celestine 9 Seraphim Squad with 2 HF 5 BSS with HF with Immo 12 BSS 5 Doms with Immo - 4 Melta Exorcist
I'd get more sisters, meltas and vehicles for Dominions, 2 more exorcists.
What are current rumors regarding sisters? I have heard rumors of a summer release and a release next year. New models and new codex. However, I hear this every fraking year and every fraking year nothing happens, so anyone know if there is more to it now?
You roll saves first, then the d3 for number of wounds. So the D weapon sequence forces a single save, which if failed, causes d3+1 wounds.
This. Save the 1 Auto-wound, and then resolve the D3 (there is no +1) or the D6+6 Wounds if you fail that save.
Rarely matters on standard 1W sisters though =P
I have some trouble understanding this. Are you trying to use shield of faith to save against a 6 on the Destroyer table? If so, I think the wording in the book is "no saves of any kind are allowed" on a 6. (I don't have the book with me so I might be wrong). Which means you can't take inv saves against a 6.
However, it also says that wounds do not transfer, so a WK firing a wraith cannon and does D6 + 6 wounds can still only kill 1 sister in a squad.
I would say our best defense is the low cost units we have, and having MSU so a 400 point D-Scythe WG squad with serpent can only kill at most do 100 points in damage as long as you don't let their flamers cover multiple units.
PanzerLeader wrote: Anyone got any experience with using assassins as allies then
I had a fight against them as Tau last week. Opponent tried to start his (female?) assassin 1" from my warlord, but I denied it by placing lots of units around my warlord which he would need to charge through first. I then spent the following round pumping 100-150 shots at BS 1 to kill her.
The sniper I took out with S8 missiles, launched 6 of them, he failed one save and I insta killed it.
The anti-psyker guy (kinda useless against Tau) took two rounds of shooting to kill since you have to fire BS1 at him as well. We had a rule discussion here because I used marker ligts at BS1 to target him, when one of them hit I could fire a missile at BS5 (In the tau codex it says that missiles are always fired at BS5). Anyway it failed to wound but if it had then it would have insta killed him.
The last guy, (a melee guy?) I just shot down without much difficulty.
So that was around 600 points in 2 rounds of combat.
Acidian wrote: What are current rumors regarding sisters? I have heard rumors of a summer release and a release next year. New models and new codex. However, I hear this every fraking year and every fraking year nothing happens, so anyone know if there is more to it now?
There is nothing new. 'Sisters coming in plastic' same as every year.
@ Acidian: I think we're talking about using "Shield of Faith" on a roll of 2-5 on the Destroyer Table. At least I am. A roll of "6" does ignore all saves, including invulnerables.
I usually run with Celestine in my army, but if I wanted to try running a cannoness, do you guys have any tips on how to best equip her? Is it better to have her in a unit or by herself? Command squad seems a bit expensive for what you get out of it, and I would probably end up using heavy weapons in it if I did take it, so not the best place for a canonness to be loitering.
PanzerLeader wrote: @ Acidian: I think we're talking about using "Shield of Faith" on a roll of 2-5 on the Destroyer Table. At least I am. A roll of "6" does ignore all saves, including invulnerables.
Alright, it was just me who didn't understand then.
Acidian wrote: What are current rumors regarding sisters? I have heard rumors of a summer release and a release next year. New models and new codex. However, I hear this every fraking year and every fraking year nothing happens, so anyone know if there is more to it now?
There is nothing new. 'Sisters coming in plastic' same as every year.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Sorry, one more question. I still haven't gotten my head around the 7th edition detachment rules. Can I I take a CAD of SoB and then add a Crimson Hunter formation/detachment from the Eldar codex? Or how about the firebase support cadre from Tau?
Acidian wrote: Sorry, one more question. I still haven't gotten my head around the 7th edition detachment rules. Can I I take a CAD of SoB and then add a Crimson Hunter formation/detachment from the Eldar codex? Or how about the firebase support cadre from Tau?
I know nothing about the Crimson Hunter thingy, so I don't know if there are any special prerequisites for it. The firebase support cadre, though, I do know about. The answer is "yes". Although fluff-purists like myself will raise an eyebrow at you.
There is no limitation of what detachments/formations your army is made up from, unless those are imposed by the detachment itself. For example, you could not have two formations which force you to make on of its members your warlord.
See this picture for an example of a perfectly legal battleforged army:
Being a SoB purist is the reason I almost always end up playing another faction at higher point games since I get too worried about opponent bringing flyers. So at <1000 points I usually play pure sisters, at >1000 I always play something else. So now I kinda want to try a SisDar list with a Crimson Hunter formation.
(OK, so this is why I was looking at the Deredeo Pattern Dreadnought. You can get skyfire, interceptor then shoot 4 times with a twin-linked S8 gun that rerolls armor pen and 3 times with a S6 missile launcher. I'm pretty sure it can reliably erase a single flyer the turn it comes in.)
Acidian wrote: I usually run with Celestine in my army, but if I wanted to try running a cannoness, do you guys have any tips on how to best equip her? Is it better to have her in a unit or by herself? Command squad seems a bit expensive for what you get out of it, and I would probably end up using heavy weapons in it if I did take it, so not the best place for a canonness to be loitering.
She's 'best' used in Melee with an Eviscerator/Rosarius/Mantle and a couple of Priests to buff the unit she's in imo. Celestians can work alright, or a Battle Conclave. The real problem you'll have is a lack of a delivery platform, since Rhinos or Repressors are your only real choice. If you are allying, attaching the Cannoness and the Priests to something that's half-decent in Melee can work wonders since the Priest buffs are amazing.
Acidian wrote: I usually run with Celestine in my army, but if I wanted to try running a cannoness, do you guys have any tips on how to best equip her? Is it better to have her in a unit or by herself? Command squad seems a bit expensive for what you get out of it, and I would probably end up using heavy weapons in it if I did take it, so not the best place for a canonness to be loitering.
She's 'best' used in Melee with an Eviscerator/Rosarius/Mantle and a couple of Priests to buff the unit she's in imo. Celestians can work alright, or a Battle Conclave. The real problem you'll have is a lack of a delivery platform, since Rhinos or Repressors are your only real choice. If you are allying, attaching the Cannoness and the Priests to something that's half-decent in Melee can work wonders since the Priest buffs are amazing.
So you end up spending a lot of points on a mediocre sister unit and probably a Rhino to field her. I miss the days when she could just jump pack around and eviscerate vehicles by herself.
Ive got a 1000pt random team tournament coming up next weekend and ill be breaking out the old Witchhunter-style dex:
Uriah
2 X BSS (2 Flamer in Immo with MM)
Dominions (4 MG in Repressor)
Ordo Mallous Inquisitor (Warlord, Terminator armor, psyker, psycannon, daemonhammer, Liber Heresius)
Goon Squad of 2 crusaders, 4 DCAs in a Land Raider Redeemer
Plan is pretty simple, Uriah joins the Inq squad and then I scout the Doms and the LRR up towards the foe, melt something open and charge in with the blender squad to clean up.
BSS hold objectives, simple as that.
I know the LRR is a LOT of points but I really wanted to use the blender effect of the DCAs as well as keep them safe. I went with the LRR because the the fire-spewing fluff aspect.
Should be fun!
I'd say you'd be better off getting an Ordo Xenos guy with grenades and using the points freed up to buy a second priest with the Litanies of Faith (For two guaranteed priest buffs).
The terminator armor costs you your ability to make sweeping advances. The priest and Inq can both carry melta bombs if you run into walkers.
You roll saves first, then the d3 for number of wounds. So the D weapon sequence forces a single save, which if failed, causes d3+1 wounds.
This. Save the 1 Auto-wound, and then resolve the D3 (there is no +1) or the D6+6 Wounds if you fail that save.
Rarely matters on standard 1W sisters though =P
I have some trouble understanding this. Are you trying to use shield of faith to save against a 6 on the Destroyer table? If so, I think the wording in the book is "no saves of any kind are allowed" on a 6. (I don't have the book with me so I might be wrong). Which means you can't take inv saves against a 6.
However, it also says that wounds do not transfer, so a WK firing a wraith cannon and does D6 + 6 wounds can still only kill 1 sister in a squad.
I would say our best defense is the low cost units we have, and having MSU so a 400 point D-Scythe WG squad with serpent can only kill at most do 100 points in damage as long as you don't let their flamers cover multiple units.
Yes, confusion: The earlier posts were cut out from that discussion:
BlackTalos wrote: Yeah i'd agree that it would be quite situational.
And when it comes to D-Weapons, we are probably the best equipped. What other army can deny anything but a "6" with their own "6" on every single model?
BlackTalos wrote: Anyone got any experience with using assassins as allies then
I had a fight against them as Tau last week. Opponent tried to start his (female?) assassin 1" from my warlord, but I denied it by placing lots of units around my warlord which he would need to charge through first. I then spent the following round pumping 100-150 shots at BS 1 to kill her.
The sniper I took out with S8 missiles, launched 6 of them, he failed one save and I insta killed it.
The anti-psyker guy (kinda useless against Tau) took two rounds of shooting to kill since you have to fire BS1 at him as well. We had a rule discussion here because I used marker ligts at BS1 to target him, when one of them hit I could fire a missile at BS5 (In the tau codex it says that missiles are always fired at BS5). Anyway it failed to wound but if it had then it would have insta killed him.
The last guy, (a melee guy?) I just shot down without much difficulty.
So that was around 600 points in 2 rounds of combat.
I was asking more about getting the Assassins as part of a Sisters army. The Culexus (Anti-psyker) seems like a good choice for any AS player, as you can give him Warp Charge dice from your pool (which you have so much use for, as Sisters lol). That or Vindicaire, methinks. For the long-range Vehicle/specialist killer when your exorcists have better targets...
(OK, so this is why I was looking at the Deredeo Pattern Dreadnought. You can get skyfire, interceptor then shoot 4 times with a twin-linked S8 gun that rerolls armor pen and 3 times with a S6 missile launcher. I'm pretty sure it can reliably erase a single flyer the turn it comes in.)
HERESY! lol
I now suggest adding the Auto-cannons on your Imperial Knights. Cause most of us Sisters player have the Knight, anyway =P
Yeah, I was just relating to how a battle against an opponent that was using Assassins as allies and how that went.
I was actually fighting the sniper assassin again yesterday, and I killed him with Wave Serpent fire before he even got a shot of. He can be kinda scary with his precision shots to my farseer. They seem very expensive for what you get out of them though?
Anyway, the new IK with the anti-air option definitely seems interesting. I will probably buy one and do some sister battles with it later this month, see how it faires compared to adding a Firebase Support Cadre or Crimson Death.
I just thought it was worth a mention since a lot of Sisters of Battles players already have a knight.
Shame you need a full new box and can't just get the 1 Sprue they've added..... but at least the rules exist for conversions =P
I've always heard the assassins rarely make up their points, which is why i'm asking if their synergy with Sisters would work? I'd go on an assassins thread to know how they play/their rules on their own, and i know they can't join or be joined... but say you play 1700pts of sisters, would 300pts be worth a few more sister or an assassin, is what i'm trying to figure out =D
At 1700 you probably have everything you can slot into a CAD on sisters, so the question is more if there are other better things to ally in. The answer to that is yes, BUT assassin models look really cool so play them anyway, and they are good units just not crazy good.
Acidian wrote: At 1700 you probably have everything you can slot into a CAD on sisters, so the question is more if there are other better things to ally in. The answer to that is yes, BUT assassin models look really cool so play them anyway, and they are good units just not crazy good.
Or take a second CAD/Allied detachment of sisters.
You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.
I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.
Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).
You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.
I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.
Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).
Right, I forgot I needed an extra Retributor there. My bad.
I am unsure why would the plasma pistol be a larger problem with getting into assault than any other weapon in my unit. They spam 4x flame templates from flamer pistols, flame template from celestine, and 14 bolt pistol shots. If I am worried about charge range then I have to keep the whole unit from shooting, not just the plasma pistol. Also they get reroll to charge. The plasma pistol is an extra S7 shot if I have to charge a vehicle or an AP2 shot if I have to charge marines or centurions. Regarding the sword, Is an AP3+ sword that bad on a unit that will be in assault as much as possible? She has 4 attacks on the charge, S3 is a problem against MC and centeurions, but MC is usually a death sentence for them to charge. Still, if I am tight on points the pistol is usually the first to go, followed by the melta bomb and then the sword, If I remove the superior as well, that's 40 points saved on upgrades.
4x rending heavy flamers sounds fun. Only problem would be getting them close enough to use them.
Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.
You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.
I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.
Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).
Right, I forgot I needed an extra Retributor there. My bad.
I am unsure why would the plasma pistol be a larger problem with getting into assault than any other weapon in my unit. They spam 4x flame templates from flamer pistols, flame template from celestine, and 14 bolt pistol shots. If I am worried about charge range then I have to keep the whole unit from shooting, not just the plasma pistol. Also they get reroll to charge. The plasma pistol is an extra S7 shot if I have to charge a vehicle or an AP2 shot if I have to charge marines or centurions. Regarding the sword, Is an AP3+ sword that bad on a unit that will be in assault as much as possible? She has 4 attacks on the charge, S3 is a problem against MC and centeurions, but MC is usually a death sentence for them to charge. Still, if I am tight on points the pistol is usually the first to go, followed by the melta bomb and then the sword, If I remove the superior as well, that's 40 points saved on upgrades.
4x rending heavy flamers sounds fun. Only problem would be getting them close enough to use them.
4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.
As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).
4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.
As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).
Just my $0.02.
I don't like Imperial Guard or Space Marines, so I would rather not ally them in. Especially when I was trying to work the list around the 3 Crimson Hunters from Eldar that are the best anti-flyer units in the game bar none, and who also rocks 4x S8 AP2 Lance shots at BS4/5 to cover for the lack of Exorcists.
I would probably run them in an Immolator. I could go for another Repressor, but then I would have to order more from FW. I will have to try them out and see how I like them.
Celtic Strike wrote:Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.
Well I do run Celestine in the same squad, unless if I want to tie up two shooty units in assault and I split her off. Because the Seraphim are 12" range, they usually find themselves, with my warlord, on the opponents table side with all his big guns pointing at them. Assaulting with them is not so much to do damage, but more to lock them in combat so they can't be shot at, lock another shooty unit in combat so they can't shoot at me, and then Hit and Run out in the end of opponents assault phase. Since they are in assault so much, and you might end up charging the same unit every assault phase, then the 4 attacks from the power sword superior should make up it's worth. I do agree that most of the damage is done in shooting though, and Celestine is the main damage dealer in assault.
It really sucks that Celestine is not Eternal Warrior.
4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.
As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).
Just my $0.02.
I don't like Imperial Guard or Space Marines, so I would rather not ally them in. Especially when I was trying to work the list around the 3 Crimson Hunters from Eldar that are the best anti-flyer units in the game bar none, and who also rocks 4x S8 AP2 Lance shots at BS4/5 to cover for the lack of Exorcists.
I would probably run them in an Immolator. I could go for another Repressor, but then I would have to order more from FW. I will have to try them out and see how I like them.
Celtic Strike wrote:Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.
Well I do run Celestine in the same squad, unless if I want to tie up two shooty units in assault and I split her off. Because the Seraphim are 12" range, they usually find themselves, with my warlord, on the opponents table side with all his big guns pointing at them. Assaulting with them is not so much to do damage, but more to lock them in combat so they can't be shot at, lock another shooty unit in combat so they can't shoot at me, and then Hit and Run out in the end of opponents assault phase. Since they are in assault so much, and you might end up charging the same unit every assault phase, then the 4 attacks from the power sword superior should make up it's worth. I do agree that most of the damage is done in shooting though, and Celestine is the main damage dealer in assault.
It really sucks that Celestine is not Eternal Warrior.
This is how I use seraphim. It helps keep them alive by keeping them from being shot at. Celstine can hold her own in cc but it is more about protecting them from shooting. Then you hit and run and you are free to find a new target or just shoot the same squad again. My last game I shot and then assaulted a havoc squad in order to protect them from shooting as well as preventing the havoc squad from shooting up my transports. After my opponents assault phase I H&R and finished them off with shooting.
This is how I use seraphim. It helps keep them alive by keeping them from being shot at. Celstine can hold her own in cc but it is more about protecting them from shooting. Then you hit and run and you are free to find a new target or just shoot the same squad again. My last game I shot and then assaulted a havoc squad in order to protect them from shooting as well as preventing the havoc squad from shooting up my transports. After my opponents assault phase I H&R and finished them off with shooting.
Yeah, this is how I want to use them. Only problem I can see is if you are facing vehicle heavy lists then you might not have stuff to assault. Also, deep strike mishap with celestine and celestials would hurt so much.
4 attacks = .66 wounds on MEQ on average. That power sword is 4/9ths of a dead marine per charge. It's worse than the pistol in efficiency. Plus now you have a 55 point model that is definitely not pulling her weight. The main purpose of the Seraphim Superior is to eat challenges for Celestine.
Yeah. I've deepstruck Celestine exactly once and that's because 2 of my opponent's 3 ObSec troops were scouts riding in landspeeder storms in reserve. Gave me a chance to drop right in next to them and have fun flame times. Usually its much better to start her on the table and take advantage of LOS blocking terrain to close.
Mavnas wrote: 4 attacks = .66 wounds on MEQ on average. That power sword is 4/9ths of a dead marine per charge. It's worse than the pistol in efficiency. Plus now you have a 55 point model that is definitely not pulling her weight. The main purpose of the Seraphim Superior is to eat challenges for Celestine.
Alright, I will drop the sword onward. I think the seraphim superior could use eviscerator at one point, and I just kept it in my head that she was still decent in melee. As pietre made me aware of, the sword is worth one Repressor upgrade by itself.
Thanks for the help!
Edit: Pretty happy with the new list, dropped 2 extra seraphims, pistol and sword and made room for repressors across the board and combi-plasmas for my BSS. Not sure if combi-melta might be, plasma is a tad more versatile and has 2 shots. I also have the converted models ready with plasma.
I think that combi plasma is fine as well. You get plenty of melta anyways and it can be nice to double tap in order to get that extra meq kill in there.
Nice. I'll be there with my Sisters/AM list as well. What are you bringing for a list?
currently....
HQ celestine 135
HQ 2 priests, one with litanies, all with mauls, one is warlord 95
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
HQ Master of the forge with bike, shield eternal 165
Troops 5 scouts with bolters, sargent with melta bomb 60
Heavy Sicaran battle tank with lascannon sponsons, schisms of mars 200
Nice. I'll be there with my Sisters/AM list as well. What are you bringing for a list?
currently....
HQ celestine 135 HQ 2 priests, one with litanies, all with mauls, one is warlord 95 Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265 Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265 Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145 Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145 Heavy exorcist 125 Heavy exorcist 125 Heavy exorcist 125 HQ Master of the forge with bike, shield eternal 165 Troops 5 scouts with bolters, sargent with melta bomb 60 Heavy Sicaran battle tank with lascannon sponsons, schisms of mars 200
the marines are white scars....
Nice. But with that list, you might as well go Iron Hands and give your Sicaran It Will Not Die and improve the Master of Forge's repair rolls. There are some really nice relics in the Clan Raukann supplement that would boost your Sisters shooting as well, like the Tempered Helm. 35 points, allows all friendly units in 24" to use the bearers LD for morale and one unit in 12" to reroll To Hit rolls of 1 in the shooting phase.
I'm running the following:
Celestine 2x5 Sisters, HF, flamer, Rhino 3x5 Dominions, 4x Melta, combi-melta, veteran sister. 2 have Immolators with multi-melta, dozer blades, and laud hailers. 3x Exorcists Company Command Squad, master of ordnance, lascannon Veterans, 3x plasma, chimera Vendetta 2x Wyverns
Celestine continues to be a solid HQ choice. The ability to raise again on the next turn has on two occasions secured me a victory point on the final turn (both games winning by a single point),
The Repressor is amazing. That AV13 front armour and heavy flamer makes a difference every time. Either it survives and gets my unit onto an objective quick or the enemy uses its strongest weapons to pop it (leaving my Exorcists etc alive).
Exorcists are super unpredictable. They are also a threat on the table. The models catches the eye and they can take out anything. Even if they don't do loads of damage it again attracts enemy attention.
Dominions. Outflanking. Melta-a-go-go. A must.
Small units. Always in vehicles. My only concern of this tactic is that it leaves the Seraphim as the only reasonable target for blast weapons (Guard especially). Hydras would mince them turn 1. But everything has a weakness.
Overall, love my army. Don't love the cost. A shame that the more unique units read like crap on the page.
Seraphim's have always been useful for me and the 'what if' of blast templates hasn't put me off yet. And the models are excellent. A big pull for me.
Agreed on the scouting. I'm currently playing at 1000 points. I'll certainly be adding more Dominions as the points go up.
Not sure about the third Heavy slot - either another Exorcist or the Strike Fighter to rinse AP3. I would love to run a unit of Penitent Engines but that'd be expensive in points; there's part of me that believes the sight of them charging up the field would be a huge distraction to the enemy force as well as much fun. Oh, but they're big metal models. Sod that.
I rarely scout my domms. I always outflank with them and it has worked out really well expect once.
I love Seraphim as well. They feel like the "archetypal sister unit" Celestine adds a lot to their effectiveness and without her they do suffer a bit. I wish there was a relic jump pack that granted the user H&R and some other small bonuses so the cannones could also be used in Seraphim squads effectively.
MrFlutterPie wrote: I rarely scout my domms. I always outflank with them and it has worked out really well expect once.
What?
If you have first turn, why wouldn't you scout them? Redeploy 12", move 6, Shoot 12". Next turn, nuke something else. First turn alpha strike is important.
I play on terrain heavy boards that limit the actual movement of the tank itself making the first turn alpha strike tough. I also seem to be rolling corner or football field deployment so it can save me time popping out on the other side.
My group also loves thunderfire cannons, devastators/havoks/sternguard in heavy cover. The ability to outflank and hit their lines from behind or the side skipping having to drive through tight choke points and limited firing visibility makes outflanking with ignore cover melts so much better. It also catches my opponents by surprise a lot and has gotten me linebreaker in more games then I can count.
Sometimes my opponent commits too much of his forces up board so now my domms are free to wreck face in his backfield something fierce.
For first turn alpha strike I use exo fire. While unreliable the ability to hide them behind los blocking terrain to protect them first turn then moving the 6" to shoot has served me well.
I have to agree with Pretre, not only start with everything on the table for the alpha strike, but also for target saturation. I have also had bad luck with reinforcements where 1 dominion squad came on the table at a time and was focus fired down. Also, if you roll bad on outflank on the wrong deployment then they might have to drive for a turn or two to even get to a target.
I love seraphims, and they are my favorite model, but they can't really compare to dominions in a repressor. So if you want to minmax then that is the way to go. Pretre will also tell you to not to deepstrike with them, and after doing just that some games, listen to him. I lost the unit in one game to the warp after failing to get on the table for 2 rounds. Then in another game they deepstriked down, and they have to be spaced with 0" apart, so the unit got annihilated by one howitzer. Which instakills Celestine as well. It sucks so much that she doesn't have eternal warrior after they nerfed her ressurection ability.
I put two squads of Doms in Repressors up front everygame. Next to a land raider with liber for its own scout with dca. Move everything 12 before the game starts, use the land raider on one side of the column to shield the weaker side armour of the Repressors for heavier fire. If you go first, 2 dead vehicles or important squads from the comfort of their ride with a land raider waiting to stike next turn. If you go second, give them a choice, what part of that formation do you want to survive to the next turn. Anyone whose seen my battle reports know that it's my favorite tactic
One thing I've been wanting to do is to get a a squad of IG vets in Chimeras with an inquisitor to scout them forward. Bring a the command squad up normally in a chimera behind them to order them to ignore cover (obviously the first squad has to disembark) then wedge that unit between two units of doms.
Now there's 8 melta and 6 plasma shots that ignore cover scouting forward. Melta to pop something, cover ignoring plasma to clean up the squad that came out and is hiding in the wreckage, or just 14 armor and cover ignoring shots.
Although last game was a 2v2 at 1500 points each and my second doms squad had nothing to murder turn 1. I ended up shooting them at some bikers turn 2. They spent the next 4 rounds in an assault vs. the 1 surviving biker with no one being able to inflict casualties.
Mavnas wrote: One thing I've been wanting to do is to get a a squad of IG vets in Chimeras with an inquisitor to scout them forward. Bring a the command squad up normally in a chimera behind them to order them to ignore cover (obviously the first squad has to disembark) then wedge that unit between two units of doms.
Now there's 8 melta and 6 plasma shots that ignore cover scouting forward. Melta to pop something, cover ignoring plasma to clean up the squad that came out and is hiding in the wreckage, or just 14 armor and cover ignoring shots.
Although last game was a 2v2 at 1500 points each and my second doms squad had nothing to murder turn 1. I ended up shooting them at some bikers turn 2. They spent the next 4 rounds in an assault vs. the 1 surviving biker with no one being able to inflict casualties.
That's actually a great idea with the Inquisitor. 49 points gets you the base Inquisitor, the Liber Hersius, and 3 servo skulls. Adds a ton of versatility to the army and if you're not running IG allies, you can add him to any Sisters squad for the same scout benefit.
So Killadelphia is in the books. Frgsinwntr and I ended up playing round 4. Great game there between two very different Sisters lists. I ended up finishing 5-1 and 10th overall (5th highest in pure BP, paint scores dropped me back significantly). If people are interested, I'll post up some summaries. I ended up playing against 5 flyrant nids, traditional IG, DE beast star with Talos support, centurion star, and drop pod IG in addition to Sisters.
Played four games with the Sisters at the weekend. Both Exorcists did nothing in offensive but took all the attention at first. Seraphims did most of the leg work. Especially when I used their re-roll to pass five of six invulnerable saves.
AV13 front on the Repressor makes a big difference.
Not sure about doubling out on the melta i.e. melta doms w/ immmolator and multi-melta. The extra heavy flamer template feels like it could work better especially with all the jink.
Or maybe my next points/purchase is on a heavy flamer Dominion squad.
Also want that plane. Bless my wallet.
And an urge to run a unit of three Penitent Engines continues. Would happily run them if they a) weren't metal and b) didn't cost a fortune for a unit.
Yeah, I run 3x 5 Doms with 4 Melta in 3 Repressors.
It is nasty as hell.
I never run flamer doms anymore since we lost TL.
You struggled with jink? My friend played Dark Angels all with bikes and skimmers. Jinks everywhere.
What does that have to do with it? And Doms love jinkers. Declare Doms at bike/skimmer. If they jink, you can choose to ignore cover, if they don't you don't. I love order of operations.
Automatically Appended Next Post: My no flamers on doms thing is because the current AOF doesn't help out flamers. The old one gave TL which let you reroll wounds. Made flamer doms very nasty.
Yeah, I run 3x 5 Doms with 4 Melta in 3 Repressors.
It is nasty as hell.
I never run flamer doms anymore since we lost TL.
You struggled with jink? My friend played Dark Angels all with bikes and skimmers. Jinks everywhere.
What does that have to do with it? And Doms love jinkers. Declare Doms at bike/skimmer. If they jink, you can choose to ignore cover, if they don't you don't. I love order of operations.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
My no flamers on doms thing is because the current AOF doesn't help out flamers. The old one gave TL which let you reroll wounds. Made flamer doms very nasty.
You're right. I forgot about that as I pulled that special off and then fluffed all the shots. But an alpha strike with AV13 is a neat idea. Will consider it.
Zefig wrote: I've been getting fantastic results with melta doms in repressors too. Makes for a nasty unit and the heavy flamer on the repressor is just gravy.
Zefig wrote: I've been getting fantastic results with melta doms in repressors too. Makes for a nasty unit and the heavy flamer on the repressor is just gravy.
And snap firing the storm bolter.
If I ever get a kill from a snap-firing storm bolter, that repressor is getting a promotion.
ShaneTB wrote: Shame the Repressor kit has been out of stock for ages...
I feel like I repost this every couple pages or so, but here we go:
In my army, I have: Rhinos - Normal rhino kit painted SOB Immolators - Immolator kit painted SOB using Immo Turrets Repressors - Immolator kit painted SOB using Immo Kit Cupola with SB/HF on it, Leman Russ Dozer Blade and Penitent Engine Driver magnetized to front
Basically, my immos and Repressors are the same vehicles magnetized for swapping.
You can see an Immo and 3 Repressors in this pic:
Automatically Appended Next Post: Here's a close-up from before I swapped the dozers to be more sizeable.
Yeah, I run 3x 5 Doms with 4 Melta in 3 Repressors.
It is nasty as hell.
I never run flamer doms anymore since we lost TL.
You struggled with jink? My friend played Dark Angels all with bikes and skimmers. Jinks everywhere.
What does that have to do with it? And Doms love jinkers. Declare Doms at bike/skimmer. If they jink, you can choose to ignore cover, if they don't you don't. I love order of operations.
Automatically Appended Next Post: My no flamers on doms thing is because the current AOF doesn't help out flamers. The old one gave TL which let you reroll wounds. Made flamer doms very nasty.
Aren't acts of faith at the beginning of the phase?
A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase;
So it doesn't have to be beginning of the phase, but it's before you can do anything with the unit such as declare a target. Declaring a target is step 1 of the shooting sequence, i.e. after you've nominated a unit to do the shooting.
ShaneTB wrote: Shame the Repressor kit has been out of stock for ages...
I feel like I repost this every couple pages or so, but here we go:
In my army, I have:
Rhinos - Normal rhino kit painted SOB
Immolators - Immolator kit painted SOB using Immo Turrets
Repressors - Immolator kit painted SOB using Immo Kit Cupola with SB/HF on it, Leman Russ Dozer Blade and Penitent Engine Driver magnetized to front
Basically, my immos and Repressors are the same vehicles magnetized for swapping.
You can see an Immo and 3 Repressors in this pic:
Automatically Appended Next Post: Here's a close-up from before I swapped the dozers to be more sizeable.
I know those models. You did some battle reports from a tournament you took them to last year.
I really like the FW Repressor model; maybe my favourite tank. I'll hold off conversions for now but yours have given me some ideas.
Automatically Appended Next Post: From FW:
"Thanks for your email about the Repressor. At the moment the Repressor is still being worked on and we don't have a date for when it will come back into stock. As soon as we do we will announce it in our newsflash, please keep an eye on this for more information! "
I shall wait a little longer. The mass Repressor idea will be witnessed.
A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase;
So it doesn't have to be beginning of the phase, but it's before you can do anything with the unit such as declare a target. Declaring a target is step 1 of the shooting sequence, i.e. after you've nominated a unit to do the shooting.
A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase;
So it doesn't have to be beginning of the phase, but it's before you can do anything with the unit such as declare a target. Declaring a target is step 1 of the shooting sequence, i.e. after you've nominated a unit to do the shooting.
Bah! Fair enough though.
I see enough ambiguity in "immediately before it acts" =P
Movement = immediately before it moves
Shooting = immediately before it shoots (rolls To Hit with the first weapon)
Assault = immediately before it rolls 2D6 to charge
Buuuuut that's nitpicking... i agree it shall have to be before it is selected to shoot.
The rules about when you roll Acts are... annoying. By a strict interpretation of rules as written, a Sororitas Command Squad can never benefit from its Endless Crusade (Fleet, Crusader, Move Through Cover) because it's an Assault Phase act and you must roll AOF "before blows are struck," which implies after you've already made your charge move... though this is also arguably an insane piece of nitpickery.
“A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase; i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the Shooting phase, or before any blows are stuck (either by friend or foe) in the Assault phase. To do so the unit must take a Leadership test.”
Excerpt From: Workshop, Games. “Codex: Adepta Sororitas (eBook Edition).” Games Workshop Ltd, 2014-06-24. iBooks.
This material may be protected by copyright.
Well, the start of the Assault Phase before you declare charges is still "before any blows are struck in the Assault Phase". It doesn't specifically say it happens at the start of the Fight Sub-phase either (like War Hymns for example).
Yeah, I'm kinda sorry I brought that up.... There's probably a discussion in YMDC already; I was just trying to note that GW rules-writing is full of bloody holes and we hates them, yes my precious.
Mavnas wrote: Yeah... poor rules writing is one of the things that is most likely to cause me to stop playing 40K.
Not being sure how to interpret situations if I play with new people sucks.
40k is a HUGE game with literally dozens of different caveats to the core rule book. GW and their rule writing team have their plates full trying to keep everything lined up and non-contradictory and because of that it should come as no surprise that many rules (especially lesser-encountered rules such as AoF since AS isn't a highly represented army in the grand scheme of things...) are left up to the gamers to figure out. I think GW covers their arses though when they make statements about the "spirit of the game" being to create a fun game with their opponent the priority and overriding guidance above all else and it is this fact that should be expressed to newcomers to the game.
Like many other fans of this hobby/game I can put up with a wonky rule set because I can be flexible when it comes to rule interpretation. Of course GW's goal should be an air-tight rule set but with so many variables present in the game I can understand why some rules slip through the cracks.
Mavnas wrote: Yeah... poor rules writing is one of the things that is most likely to cause me to stop playing 40K.
Not being sure how to interpret situations if I play with new people sucks.
40k is a HUGE game with literally dozens of different caveats to the core rule book. GW and their rule writing team have their plates full trying to keep everything lined up and non-contradictory and because of that it should come as no surprise that many rules (especially lesser-encountered rules such as AoF since AS isn't a highly represented army in the grand scheme of things...) are left up to the gamers to figure out. I think GW covers their arses though when they make statements about the "spirit of the game" being to create a fun game with their opponent the priority and overriding guidance above all else and it is this fact that should be expressed to newcomers to the game.
Like many other fans of this hobby/game I can put up with a wonky rule set because I can be flexible when it comes to rule interpretation. Of course GW's goal should be an air-tight rule set but with so many variables present in the game I can understand why some rules slip through the cracks.
While I agree with you that making an air-tight rule-set in a game as expansive as 40K is a huge undertaking and I don't expect them to get everything right every time without hiccups. For that reason I am able to forgive much of it but with a small caveat: That GW would use and maintain a proper FAQ and errata section on their website. I don't understand why GW can't dedicate 10 minutes of someone's time to clarifying a rule on an errata of FAQ page and hitting the update button. One example that jumps to mind is using blood tithe points as khorne daemonkin to bring a bloodthirster onto the field, can he charge the next round or does he do nothing, change flight mode the next round then able to charge after 2 rounds? At the very least someone at GWHQ should be able to make a quick FAQ to let the player base know what the intent of the rule was so we knew the official stance on how to play it and wouldn't have to ask our opponent how to play a rule or roll off on what interpretation of the rule we use for the match. There's enough randomness in this game already, I don't need a wayward rule from my codex to add to it every game. I understand what you mean about their "spirit of the game" statement but I feel that's more of a cop-out than anything else, there is no reason they can't add the quick job of FAQ and errata to someone's daily chores at the office, not to mention that "spirit of the game" IMO should apply to all games, tabletop or otherwise, were all here to have fun and enjoy each others company, not argue over rules interpretations.
I don't play tournaments but I can clearly see how no FAQ or errata for official rulings can be a nightmare for tournament players and organizers alike and I can understand more frustration from the tournament scene about this. Unfortunately rules interpretations are only half the problem, the other half is the different power levels between codexes and certain OP or undercosted units. Those, while frustrating as well, are much more forgivable since balance sits on quite the knifes edge and isn't an exact science, this is where spirit of the game kicks in because if I bring a fluffy CSM list I would hope that my opponent would either build down his tournament tau list to be more fair or that I would build mine up to a more competitive level (a tough thing to do for my chaos forces given my model selection atm).
Now as a disclaimer I'd like to say I love this game and I'm super happy with my investment in it. I have a wonderful group of people I play with and they make this game so much fun for everyone despite any problems with the rules or codex power levels. At the end of the day a poor group of people to play with would still suck the fun out of the game whether the rules were perfect or not.
I'll get off the now. Sorry for the distraction from tactics talk.
I played a couple games last night with a sisters + BA drop pod list found here along with my bike canoness special character from a few pages back.
First game was against pure BA with two full tac squads in rhinos, a fast vindicator, stormraven, 5 jpdc with fist and sword, and 10 foot dc with sword, fist, a bunch of bolters, a chaplain, and a "dc" captain special character with rage, fnp, and ew, all in a LR crusader. The mission was maelstrom with diagonal deployment and 3 obj cards. It was modified for the campaign that every objective marker was a malfunctioning teleported that on a d6 roll of 1 at the end of every turn would teleport nearby units to a random objective, but that never came up in the first game.
He had first turn, deployed his LR on the line with the vindi next to it looking through a building window and the 5 DC covering their rears. One rhino per flank. He had an objective in his back field in a building bear the dc, one in the left corner I think, and one in a building in the middle. I had one on a hill in my back corner, one in a building on the left near the line, and I think one in the exact center of the field. I deployed exorcists next to the hill in the corner, bikes on the line as far as they could get from the vindi, and immolators in the center on the line.
First turn, I dont know what cards he got but he moved theulr and vindi up to the building near the middle with the dc still covering them, leaving the back objective open.rhinos moved up the flanks, no shooting.
My cards were claim the left building objective and my rear objective, plus d3 for three objectives. I brought in two melta dominion pods who landed on target, one beside the vindi and one in front of the LR. The marine pod came down between the dc and back objective, close enough to claim, and the disembarked into terrain. Bikes moved up near left building objective, one exorcist moved onto the hill to claim the rear objective, and I tried to move the other over to get a better shot on the right marine flank but it immobilized itself on a single tombstone. Presumably a saint was buried there. shooting had the vindi stunned and down two hp. Marines took out two DC. The LR had two glances and a pen that exploded it for first blood, taking out maybe a single dc. I didn't have range on the big dc blob with the bike guns, so I moved them back to make assault unlikely since the blob could have conceivably moved around the 5 melta sisters. At the end of the round, I had four objectives claimed including my two on cards, plus First blood and a 3 on the d3 making it 6 to between 0 and 2.
Turn 2, stormraven did not come in. Marine squad on left disembarked into terrain and rhino moved up and around to block off the potential bike charge. His 5-man dc shot, charged, and wiped out my marine combat squad. Right marines moved towards the sisters that meltad the vindi and took them down to 2-3. The left tacs and dc blob wiped out the left melta doms in shooting. Minimal objectives, if any.
In objectives, I drew the middle building one near the vindi, the left building near the bikes again, and the backfield one my marine pod was on. Good news. My two remaining pods both came in, so I put the meltas within range of the vindi and the right tac marines, and the hf rets behind the big dc blob. Bikes moved towards the dc blob with the trailing end on the objective. One immolator moved up to claim middle objective and have LOS around the building on the vindi. The other moved towards the left tac rhino, aiming across the bikes. Shooting saw the immolator explode the vindi, which I believe took the damaged melta team from 3 to 2. I think the left immo also exploded the left tac rhino, which hit the bikes but didn't get past the canoness. Bike shooting did surprisingly little, and took out maybe 2-3 DC, but one exorcist and the heavy flamers, even failing the rending AoF, took the squad down to one regular dc, the captain, and the chaplain. The second exorcist and two melta squads on the right took the right tac squad down to four. I tried to charge the remaining 3 dc from the blob but failed.
Turn 3, his stormraven came in and ended up shaking my left immo with the multimelta and then unloading both hurricane bolters and the assault cannon into my canoness to no effec. Left tac squad shot into them as well and I believe took out one biker. The 3 dc charged my flamer rets and list the fist and bare guy to overwatch but the sword guy swept them. Right tacs assaulted the bigger melta squad and I think killed them all, but were down to 4 guys at the end. I think the captain's squad moved back towards cover and didn't do much. At this point, he wasn't anywhere near my 9 points with most of his forces gone, so he conceded.
The drop pods were super useful in getting the dominions where they needed to be to inflict maximum carnage, which let me corral his most dangerous units inside his deployment zone and pick them apart. I'm really liking the bike canoness too for her tankiness, but that's not super helpful for the tactica. The bikes in general did bring some reliable, mobile volume of fire that supplemented the sisters well though, like the plasma tac squad. It all worked pretty well together.
I'll write up the second battle against tau when I get a chance.
The tau battle ended similarly, with a turn 3 concession. Not nearly as many objective points, but the pods let me really apply the pressure, take out the big guns, and get my bike squad up field to smash face.
“A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase; i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the Shooting phase, or before any blows are stuck (either by friend or foe) in the Assault phase. To do so the unit must take a Leadership test.”
I've always played it so that my acts of faith were only ever usable on my own player turn.
However if I break down the above rule, it specifies that it must be used before it acts during a phase, not mentionning that the phase as to be on your own player turn.
It then goes into giving a few examples.
During your oponent's assault phase, you have a chance to get a unit to act by overwatching, so both criterias are filled.
Am I missing something or does this mean we can effectively use acts of faith during overwatch?
How about failing a leaderships test at the end of your oponent's shooting faith.
Can you use BSS's act of faith to be fearless before they act and get either pinned or run away?
Canoness - explicitly either player's assault phase
SCS - Your assault only
Celestians - Your assault only
Repentia - explicitly either player's assault phase
BSS - Your shooting or either assault phase
Dominion - Vague. Could be used in either Shooting phase, but is useless in your opponent's shooting phase.
Retributor - Vague. Could be used in either Shooting phase, but is useless in your opponent's shooting phase.
Seraphim - Vague. Could be used in either Shooting phase, but is useless in your opponent's shooting phase.
Celestine - explicitly only start of your turn.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Voldrak wrote: Am I missing something or does this mean we can effectively use acts of faith during overwatch?
How about failing a leaderships test at the end of your oponent's shooting faith.
Can you use BSS's act of faith to be fearless before they act and get either pinned or run away?
No shooting acts of faith work in the assault phase, including Seraphim.
Hokay. Tau game. It was a very casual tau list but the player was pretty experiences.
He deployed first and had two hammerheads with submunitions squeezed into the back corner with the outsides by edges, rears to a small open area, and insides against a ruin. Two fire warrior squads of 8 and 9, one in front of the hammerheads trying to bubble wrap and one up near his line in a ruin on an objective. A squad of 4 tetras on his left flank, two squads of 3 xv9 suits on his line, one squad all with the d3 hits str6 ap2 on the left and the other squad with one quad burst cannon and two with the upgraded pulse rifles on the right. His commander campaign character was behind the right xv9 squad, durable with a cyclic ion blaster, two missile pods, onager gauntlet, and a squad of three missile crisis running with him.
He had me go first, so he could shoot at all my drop units. I deployed all my bikes and vehicles behind a LoS blocking building on my line with the exorcists able to sneak up and fire around the sides.
I managed to find two gaps in the bubble wrap of the hammerheads just large enough for a pod and far enough away from the edges that I didn't worry TOO much. The first melta pod came down on target by the left hammerhead and the sister disembarked 5" into cover on the side facing. They passed their AoF and ended up stunning and destroying the railgun. The next pod tries to land on the right and scatters 11" directly off of the table and back into reserves. I place the third melta pod in the same spot and land on target, disembarking into a narrow strip of open terrain in the front facing and exploding the hammerhead, losing a melta sister in the process. Mission accomplished. The left exorcist scooted up and destroyed a terra, the second I believe took a wound off one of the xv9s. Immolators went flat out towards the fire warrior objective and bikes turbo boosted to behind the middle building. Drop pods killed a fire warrior or two from the bubble wrap squad.
He shuffled around a bit and wiped both melta squads between fire warriors and commander squad, who ended up assaulting the right melta unit and trying to challenge for an objective point. The commander whiffed but the crisis suits flattened the one remaining sister superior. Both xv9 squads unloaded on the bike squad and ended up taking the canoness down to one wound and she lost a grav gun and combi grav sarge to LOS due to my poor placement of them.
My turn saw the marine squad coming down next to the commander, and they unloaded on him for two wounds. I forgot to fire the drop pods. The immolators went flat out towards the fw objective again, forming a small armored column. The left exorcist whiffed on the tetras, who junked, and I believe the right took a wound off of one of the missile crisis suits. The bikes moved up intending to assault the closer xv9 squad but their guns ended up wiping it out handily. At the end of my turn, the only objective teleport activated and sent both his commander squad and one of my drop pods over to the fire warrior objective. He disembarked his squad over to behind the remaining xv9 squad. I disembark the pod directly in front of my armored column.
His next turn, he whiffed against the marines with thr bubble wrap fire warriors and I believe one bolter bike from the xv9s, who moved to cover the commander better. The cover from the pod ended up saving my front immolator but it was shaken by the objective fire warriors.
My next turn, the heavy flamer pod came down and scattered to the opposite side of the objective fire warriors than I'd placed it on, but still in range for burninating. when I declared their fire on the fws, my opponent removed the squad. Drop pods take the bubble wrap squad down to 4. Immolators fire on tetras but jinks save them. Exorcists and marines fire on the commander squad and end up taking it down to one missile crisis and the commander with 2 wounds left. Bikes fire on the remaining xv9s and then charge, wiping them out and placing them very close to the commander who really had nowhere else to run. At this point, my opponent conceded.
I learned an important lesson about keeping the ablative wounds right next to my character, and otherwise had a pretty succesful game.
Just finished up my league this week. The girls went 3-3 which I am pleased with. I spent yesterday gluing a ton of backpacks, jump packs and guns that had broken off during battle in the last 6 weeks lol.
I am desperate to add new stuff to my army but there isn't anything sister left for me to buy. I am thinking about running the flesh tearer formation that gives us a ton of drop pods. However, I noticed that the formation gives the option of taking up to 3 heavy support choices. I have always admired the Baal predator (where is Sister Sydney he gets it damnit!) and am thinking of getting a Baal Pred or two and painting it up as a sisters vehicle with a few decorations from the immolator kit to "holy it up" For an HQ I want to take a techmarine and use a normal IG Tech Priest to model it. I am then thinking of using the plastic space marine scouts but swap out their heads with female statuesque heads and use them as sister novaites. Finally, I would round it out with a couple of my homemade drop pods for my domms and rets. I also want to add in 2 repressors for my 2 BSS squads to up their survivability.
So a very rough looking list might be;
Techmarine
Cannoness
Command squad in a drop pod
2 BSS in repressors
min scout squad
2 domms in drop pods
2 rets in drop pods
Exo
2 Baal Preds
My hope would be to hit my enemy hard and fast and overwhelm them. Pods come in as needed either melta or flamers. Baal preds flat out for second turn burnation. Exo provides supporting fire with the scouts. Repressor girls go for objectives and add to the av 13 targets and soak damage. Techmarine sits tight until he is needed to repair things like the exo or repressors (he can swap his servo arm for a jump back for free for mobility)
Yeah the cannoness does suck but without Seraphim Celestine isn't as useful especially in a drop podding list. Jackie boy doesn't offer too much either siting back. The cannoness is cheap and unlocks a command squad that can carry 5 special weapons for some sweet drop podding action. So she is actually is the lesser of evils here in my eyes lol.
MrFlutterPie wrote: Yeah the cannoness does suck but without Seraphim Celestine isn't as useful especially in a drop podding list. Jackie boy doesn't offer too much either siting back. The cannoness is cheap and unlocks a command squad that can carry 5 special weapons for some sweet drop podding action. So she is actually is the lesser of evils here in my eyes lol.
I'd rather drop the command squad and take another dominion squad.
MrFlutterPie wrote: How would you run Celestine without searphim? I miss the old WD version of her where she could get up every turn if you were lucky.
I find she gets doubled out easily even and with her only coming back only once it seems to be a risky manoeuvre running her solo.
Run her solo behind terrain.
Or put her out front in the open and hope your opponent uses her for first blood. Then don't roll to get her back up and laugh maniacally.
MrFlutterPie wrote: How would you run Celestine without searphim? I miss the old WD version of her where she could get up every turn if you were lucky.
I find she gets doubled out easily even and with her only coming back only once it seems to be a risky manoeuvre running her solo.
I normally run her behind a vehicle/piece of terrain or hiding in my Company Command Squad, depending on the situation. I've deep struck her twice now because of the match up (once against Censtar to go landspeeder storm/scout hunting and once against DE/Eldar because he left squishy units exposed in his backfield in hammer and anvil), but its the exception rather than the rule. She's a great bully unit solo and can cause enough damage to make most MEQ/GEQ leery of getting close.
I bought a Plasma Obliterator today. I think we were discussing it's possibility's for sisters in here a little back.
What was the consensus? Domms for ignores cover? Stick a naked Cannoness in there to actually use her? A Inquisitor with psyocculum to make shooting at psykers BS 10? (Suffer not the witch to live amiright? )
Personally, I was thinking you could add an escape hatch on the Oblit, then give someone a nasty surprise when the doms popped out 12" away, moved 6" then did their thing, while a BSS or someone else walked in to take over firing duties. (Or if you had Celestine, she can manage it by herself.)
It just seems odd to summon a supernatural entity like Saint Celestine and then tell her, as she hovers glowing in the air, to go sit in a pillbox. Also Celestine's mainly a short-ranged-shooting and close combat monster: the Ardent Blade and WS:7 I:7 A:5 seem wasted manning a gun.
You can assault after disembarking from a fortification even if it's destroyed. You blast some guys with da big gunz and when they come knocking you rush Celestine out and really get the party started
"Ha! The girl soldiers' pathetic fortress lies in RUINS, my Chaos brothers! Now we only have to slaughter the surviving gun crew and ..... OH WE ARE FETHED."
SisterSydney wrote: It just seems odd to summon a supernatural entity like Saint Celestine and then tell her, as she hovers glowing in the air, to go sit in a pillbox. Also Celestine's mainly a short-ranged-shooting and close combat monster: the Ardent Blade and WS:7 I:7 A:5 seem wasted manning a gun.
And BS:7 seems wasted on the occasional krak grenade.
Yeah. The plasma oblit will ruin the day of anyone that lacks long-range anti-tank, and with Celestine inside, probably the day of anyone that tries to rush it with short-range stuff.
Wargamescon is allowing 3 detachments this year. Would you keep the vendetta in my current list (see above) or would you replace it with a 3rd immolator, inquisitor with servo skulls, psyoccolum, and Liber Hersius, and some extra sisters for the troop squads?
PanzerLeader wrote: Wargamescon is allowing 3 detachments this year. Would you keep the vendetta in my current list (see above) or would you replace it with a 3rd immolator, inquisitor with servo skulls, psyoccolum, and Liber Hersius, and some extra sisters for the troop squads?
PanzerLeader wrote: Wargamescon is allowing 3 detachments this year. Would you keep the vendetta in my current list (see above) or would you replace it with a 3rd immolator, inquisitor with servo skulls, psyoccolum, and Liber Hersius, and some extra sisters for the troop squads?
AM Allies
Company Command Squad, Master of Ordnance, Lascannon
Veterans, 3 plasma guns, Chimera w/ heavy flamer
Vendetta
2x Wyverns
I could drop the Vendetta to add a third immolator for the last dominion squad and add in an Inquisitor with 3 Servo Skulls, Liber Hersius and Psyocculm. It'd also leave me about 21 points short of 1850 so there'd be a little wiggle room. I'd lose my dedicated AA and some late game mobility, but I'd add a potential 4th scouting unit, completely shut down enemy scouting and infiltrating and get some good anti-psyker shooting.
It looks similar to a list I wanted to build, except in mine the CCS is in a Chimera too. This allows them to keep up with the Vets, who would also scout forward with the inquisitor, get out of their chimera then be ordered to ignore cover, bringing the total turn 1 cover ignoring AP1-2 shots to 18.
Mavnas wrote:It looks similar to a list I wanted to build, except in mine the CCS is in a Chimera too. This allows them to keep up with the Vets, who would also scout forward with the inquisitor, get out of their chimera then be ordered to ignore cover, bringing the total turn 1 cover ignoring AP1-2 shots to 18.
Unfortunately my command squad isn't modelled to take advantage of that. I'd have to swap out the Master of Ordnance and the lascannon for a 4x plasma or 4x melta set up. I really like the Master of Ordnance though. He doesn't hit dead on target very often, but when he does its devastating combined with the "ignore cover" order and against vehicles/TEQ/MCs the lascannon synergizes well for S, AP, and range. He's also great for forcing MEQs to spread out and give me more openings to pick apart because they have to respect his blast ability. I'll play with squeezing a chimera in and doing the weapon swap, but I'm not sure its worth the trade. I really like my current balance this list has of 1 large blast, 8 small blasts, and multiple templates.
pretre wrote:I like the idea of mech'ing up the doms on the ground. I'd love to see Repressors instead of immos for the doms too.
So the foot doms used to ride around in the vendetta and grav-chute out. I think converting up some Repressors might be my summer project but I don't think I'll get it done in time for Wargamescon.
“A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase; i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the Shooting phase, or before any blows are stuck (either by friend or foe) in the Assault phase. To do so the unit must take a Leadership test.”
I've always played it so that my acts of faith were only ever usable on my own player turn.
However if I break down the above rule, it specifies that it must be used before it acts during a phase, not mentionning that the phase as to be on your own player turn.
It then goes into giving a few examples.
During your oponent's assault phase, you have a chance to get a unit to act by overwatching, so both criterias are filled.
Am I missing something or does this mean we can effectively use acts of faith during overwatch?
How about failing a leaderships test at the end of your oponent's shooting faith.
Can you use BSS's act of faith to be fearless before they act and get either pinned or run away?
Bit late to the party, kinda like celestine sitting in the Plasma bunker.....
But the BSS (which is indeed no longer fearless but PE now) Act of Faith is pretty good in the Assault phase.
Disregarding the "right before blows" which would make some of the Acts pointless, if you get the PE Act off in assault, you get to re-roll 1s in Overwatch AND 1s in close combat.
Kind of a "2 for 1" deal for BSS, although you're probably giving yourself a 4% chance of winning a CC rather than a 1% chance.....
I actually keep forgetting to use the BSS act of faith. They shoot so little for me that by the time I'm remember, I've usually already rolled the dice. PE is really good, but it won't shine unless you get 10 or more in the squad.
I'm with pretre. I'm not sure they add any unique capabilities that cover a gap in the Sisters codex. AS armies don't have much problems dealing with high T monsters thanks to easy access to S8, AP1 shooting at all range bands. You're better off taking allies that help cover the distinct lack of ranged blasts/barrage for board control or add a true assault element.
I'm personally looking forward to the new SM codex. It means more options to go with the FA drop pods. I might actually drop the 4 HF rets instead pf just talking about them.
I brought the skitari codex with me, and I had a look in the cult mechanicus codex earlier today, and I also agree with pretre. I was hoping I had missed something interesting.
Skitari has Onagi Dunecrawlers that I could easily make room for in my list, but being forced to take 2 troops that I will have to put in Rhinos (or Immolators?) to get them is just not worth it.
Why can't GW just release a new sister dex with Slow and Purposeful Retributors with option for Plasma Cannons, Repressors, Celestine with Eternal Warrior, celestials that are actually good in assault, Seraphim with haywire pistol/grenades, new flyer (not HS) or Anti-Air unit, Exorcist that can be taken as Squadron, and just to be silly, a 9" tall WraithSister with SuperHeavy Bolter that shoots 3x strength D shots.
Only problem would be getting them close enough to use them.
now. Sorry for the distraction from tactics talk.
